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Pope Announces New Indulgence - 12/7/2007 1:19:23 PM
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Fritzpw_Admin
Posts: 7691
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quote:
Trips to Lourdes to cut time spent in purgatory
Pope Benedict XVI is offering relief from purgatory to Roman Catholics who travel to Lourdes over the next year, the Vatican said yesterday.
Pilgrims to the shrine in south-west France will receive "plenary indulgences" from the Pontiff, which the Church says reduce the time spent being "washed" of sin after death. The indulgences will be available from this weekend until Dec 8, 2008.
Read the rest...
I had thought the catholic church had gotten away from offering indulgences... guess I was wrong.
Please use this thread to discuss the topic of indulgences.
New Indulgence related articles:
* Pope OKs plenary indulgence for Lourdes' 150th anniversary
Here are some links to other catholic topics:
< Message edited by Fritzpw_Admin -- 12/7/2007 1:25:52 PM >
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RE: Pope Announces New Indulgence - 12/7/2007 1:27:37 PM
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laura...
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quote:
The Pope is expected to visit next year, possibly in September or October.
Does this mean that the Pope is planning to cash in on his own offer?
_____________________________
This is what the Lord says: “Stop at the crossroads and look around. Ask for the old, godly way, and walk in it. Travel its path, and you will find rest for your souls. But you reply, ‘No, that’s not the road we want!’ Jer 6:16
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RE: Pope Announces New Indulgence - 12/7/2007 1:28:07 PM
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worthaboverubies
Posts: 137
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Whew..thank God, I mean thank Pope that he is in large and in charge.
Wow! He even can control how long we spend in purgatory. truly amazing.
Can you buy enough to not spend anytime in purgatory?
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RE: Pope Announces New Indulgence - 12/7/2007 1:40:08 PM
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rcjames
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Offering to keep someone out of Purgatory is a given since it does not exist.
Thanks
RC
_____________________________
Just a country Preacher's humble opinion
Read the first chapter of my latest book here;
http://www.deliveranceofsara.com
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RE: Pope Announces New Indulgence - 12/7/2007 1:45:56 PM
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lw9
Posts: 1131
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quote:
Pilgrims to the shrine in south-west France will receive "plenary indulgences" from the Pontiff, which the Church says reduce the time spent being "washed" of sin after death. The indulgences will be available from this weekend until Dec 8, 2008.
The Church teaches that people who do not go directly to heaven must spend time in purgatory, where they can be purified of residual sin.
Offering less time in a place that doesn't exist?
Priceless.
quote:
It is the latest initiative to get more pilgrims to the shrine, famous for the reported healing properties of its water. In August the Vatican opened an airline service offering pilgrims direct flights from Rome to Lourdes.
...And the Vatican admits this is really just a ploy to increase 'tourism' to the Lourdes shrine.
_____________________________
Aperture Science. We do what we must because we can.
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RE: Pope Announces New Indulgence - 12/7/2007 3:36:27 PM
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colliefan
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But the "greenies" would also want to you pay for the cabon spent on the trip in some sort of carbon credit. Plant a tree at Lourdes, etc,
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RE: Pope Announces New Indulgence - 12/7/2007 4:45:30 PM
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laura...
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quote:
ORIGINAL: 1love1God1way
quote:
ORIGINAL: laura...
An indulgence is a remission of the temporal punishment due for sins committed. A plenary indulgence is the remission of all punishment.
So, a plenary indulgence isn't just reducing the time in pergatory it would be eliminating it completely?
This is correct. If my memory serves correctly, "plenary" means "in full."
I sure am glad that Jesus provided me with plenary indulgence. Save me a lot more than the cost of a ticket to France.
_____________________________
This is what the Lord says: “Stop at the crossroads and look around. Ask for the old, godly way, and walk in it. Travel its path, and you will find rest for your souls. But you reply, ‘No, that’s not the road we want!’ Jer 6:16
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RE: Pope Announces New Indulgence - 12/7/2007 4:49:36 PM
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kmangel
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I'm planning a trip to France this spring. Maybe I should make a trip over to Lourdes. I wonder if the indulgence is tied in anyway to how much money you spend on souvenirs.
_____________________________
Heaven goes by favor. If it went by merit, you would stay out and your dog would go in.
--Mark Twain
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RE: Pope Announces New Indulgence - 12/7/2007 4:53:22 PM
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laura...
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quote:
Cardinal Stafford said the indulgence can also be applied to the souls of the faithful in purgatory.
If we make multiple trips does that mean we can apply it to anyone we know who may be stuck in purgatory? Is there a form to fill out?
_____________________________
This is what the Lord says: “Stop at the crossroads and look around. Ask for the old, godly way, and walk in it. Travel its path, and you will find rest for your souls. But you reply, ‘No, that’s not the road we want!’ Jer 6:16
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RE: Pope Announces New Indulgence - 12/7/2007 5:01:51 PM
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kmangel
Posts: 467
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quote:
ORIGINAL: laura...
If we make multiple trips does that mean we can apply it to anyone we know who may be stuck in purgatory? Is there a form to fill out?
Yep, sounds like it would be a possibility that if we have any excess on our account, we could transfer the indulgence to someone else. Would it have to be a family member, though, or anyone of our choosing?
_____________________________
Heaven goes by favor. If it went by merit, you would stay out and your dog would go in.
--Mark Twain
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RE: Pope Announces New Indulgence - 12/7/2007 5:04:45 PM
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laura...
Posts: 2842
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quote:
ORIGINAL: kmangel
quote:
ORIGINAL: laura...
If we make multiple trips does that mean we can apply it to anyone we know who may be stuck in purgatory? Is there a form to fill out?
Yep, sounds like it would be a possibility that if we have any excess on our account, we could transfer the indulgence to someone else. Would it have to be a family member, though, or anyone of our choosing?
Well, it does say they have to be faithful. Of course, that begs the question: if they are faithful, what are they doing in purgatory?
_____________________________
This is what the Lord says: “Stop at the crossroads and look around. Ask for the old, godly way, and walk in it. Travel its path, and you will find rest for your souls. But you reply, ‘No, that’s not the road we want!’ Jer 6:16
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RE: Pope Announces New Indulgence - 12/7/2007 5:27:58 PM
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Odeliya
Posts: 2380
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quote:
ORIGINAL: kmangel
I'm planning a trip to France this spring. Maybe I should make a trip over to Lourdes.
Americans shouldn’t let French beat them at this game. Give jobs to local indulgence makers and surrounding service providers.
When French wanted Disney Land- they didn’t worry about expensive trips to US, they built one by Paris!Why can’t you people organize a branch here in a similar fashion? Raw business plan:
What’s Lourdes ? Couple of kids said they they saw apparitions of Mary. That’s easily organized. Actually at any given weekend night there are plenty of people having all kinds of visions in our dorms alone. Right before finals the consumption of substances is down, but .. not an issue. We’ll get you kids with apparitions.
Miracle healings? No problem. Benny Hinn manufactures 2 dozen of those at each one of his shows
We need Pope's official acceptance of it as valid,well technicalities.. some political pressure, little schmoozing, at worse we can remind them of US nukes and casually compare sizes of Vatican to Indianapolis Colts footbal stadium. Will obtain Pope’s blessing.
As for location I need help, I don’t know States as well. Something that doesn’t have major shows yet, no Las Vegas or SF.
Iowa can have this market cornered maybe ? Ohio? any suggestions?
_____________________________
Proverbs XI:14 Where no counsel is, the people fall: but in the multitude of counselors there is safety.
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RE: Pope Announces New Indulgence - 12/7/2007 10:11:31 PM
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Acts29
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I have tried to connect the two together but I can't make the connection.
What does Lourdes have to do with purgatory? I don't get it. BTW How many indulgences does the Roman Catholic Chruch have?
I personally do not believe in purgatory. But I have family members who are Roman Catholic. I do understand their concept of purgatory. But this does not make any sense to me.
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RE: Pope Announces New Indulgence - 12/8/2007 11:19:14 AM
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Mannamuncher
Posts: 2920
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Where's the RC swagger crowd ?
Were they busted by their own leader ?
Perilous times in RC land these days ain't it ?
Gay clergy exposed and admitted to by pope.
Child molestation scandal exposed by media.
Reaching out to Buddhists, Hindu, and Muslims.
What a confused lot their followers must be !!!
Perhaps they will pickup a Bible and seek answers-
_____________________________
Effectus non excedit virtutem suae causae [the effect cannot exceed the power of its cause]
Grace may be free, but it may not be chosen...
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RE: Pope Announces New Indulgence - 12/8/2007 1:12:08 PM
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Odeliya
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Acts29
What does Lourdes have to do with purgatory?
Absolutely nothing.
Just like Pope Nicolas V's bull ordering occupation of foreign territorries/taking people into slavery;
Pope's a pact with Fascist dictator Mussolini, etc.
Pope Ben16 idea has political and financial agenda.
As the saying goes : "if someone' actions donts make sense - follow the money!"
Who benefits from it?  Why Vatican wants it?
This whole Lourdes campaign is a marketing trick serving Vatican's internal interests, like other shameless acts Popes been committing for centiries.
According to this logic a hard working , poor mother who has no money for international travel and luxury resorts in France will spend more time in Purgatory
then a rich girl that would travel to Paris to do fashion shopping and oh, yeah! - visit that pretty city of Lourdes.....
_____________________________
Proverbs XI:14 Where no counsel is, the people fall: but in the multitude of counselors there is safety.
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RE: Pope Announces New Indulgence - 12/8/2007 1:38:21 PM
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earthless
Posts: 6205
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From: where pigeons are wearing sweaters....
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This is what happens when people:
a) Don't read their Bible
b) Don't take what it says for what it is - God's truth for ALL of mankind
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Probing Today's Religious Movements | Promoting Doctrinal Discernment & Critical Thinking | Providing Reasons for Christian Faith & Ethics
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RE: Pope Announces New Indulgence - 12/8/2007 7:24:36 PM
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Acts29
Posts: 476
Joined: 1/14/2007
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Odeliya
quote:
ORIGINAL: Acts29
What does Lourdes have to do with purgatory?
Absolutely nothing.
Just like Pope Nicolas V's bull ordering occupation of foreign territorries/taking people into slavery;
Pope's a pact with Fascist dictator Mussolini, etc.
Pope Ben16 idea has political and financial agenda.
As the saying goes : "if someone' actions donts make sense - follow the money!"
Who benefits from it? Why Vatican wants it?
This whole Lourdes campaign is a marketing trick serving Vatican's internal interests, like other shameless acts Popes been committing for centiries.
According to this logic a hard working , poor mother who has no money for international travel and luxury resorts in France will spend more time in Purgatory
then a rich girl that would travel to Paris to do fashion shopping and oh, yeah! - visit that pretty city of Lourdes.....
It appears to me the members of the RCC are more capable of forgiving the leaders of the church than the leaders are able to demonstrate forgiveness towards its members.
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RE: Pope Announces New Indulgence - 12/9/2007 10:13:15 AM
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Mannamuncher
Posts: 2920
Joined: 4/13/2005
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Acts29
It appears to me the members of the RCC are more capable of forgiving the leaders of the church than the leaders are able to demonstrate forgiveness towards its members.
Funny,... ONLY Jesus forgives sin.
Yet, the RCC has the audacity to claim they do.
_____________________________
Effectus non excedit virtutem suae causae [the effect cannot exceed the power of its cause]
Grace may be free, but it may not be chosen...
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RE: Pope Announces New Indulgence - 12/9/2007 10:53:34 AM
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rcjames
Posts: 5660
Joined: 7/15/2005
From: Oklahoma
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I have been a little perplexed at the reasoning behind the announcement; possibly the Pope's cousin has a Snow Cone stand near shrine at Lourdes.
Thanks
RC
_____________________________
Just a country Preacher's humble opinion
Read the first chapter of my latest book here;
http://www.deliveranceofsara.com
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RE: Pope Announces New Indulgence - 12/9/2007 11:05:17 AM
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bttggreg
Posts: 29
Joined: 12/5/2007
From: OKC, OK
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quote:
The indulgences will be available from this weekend until Dec 8, 2008.
If I go next week and then sin on June 5, 2008, do I need to go again?
Does the coupon expire on 12/8/08? What if I don't use my indulgence before then?
This is so confusing 
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RE: Pope Announces New Indulgence - 12/9/2007 1:48:31 PM
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splangchnizomai
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Hebrews 10
1For the law having a shadow of good things to come, and not the very image of the things, can never with those sacrifices which they offered year by year continually make the comers thereunto perfect.
2For then would they not have ceased to be offered? because that the worshippers once purged should have had no more conscience of sins.
3But in those sacrifices there is a remembrance again made of sins every year.
4For it is not possible that the blood of bulls and of goats should take away sins.
5Wherefore when he cometh into the world, he saith, Sacrifice and offering thou wouldest not, but a body hast thou prepared me:
6In burnt offerings and sacrifices for sin thou hast had no pleasure.
7Then said I, Lo, I come (in the volume of the book it is written of me,) to do thy will, O God.
8Above when he said, Sacrifice and offering and burnt offerings and offering for sin thou wouldest not, neither hadst pleasure therein; which are offered by the law;
9Then said he, Lo, I come to do thy will, O God. He taketh away the first, that he may establish the second.
10By the which will we are sanctified through the offering of the body of Jesus Christ once for all.
11And every priest standeth daily ministering and offering oftentimes the same sacrifices, which can never take away sins:
12But this man, after he had offered one sacrifice for sins for ever, sat down on the right hand of God;
13From henceforth expecting till his enemies be made his footstool.
14For by one offering he hath perfected for ever them that are sanctified.
15Whereof the Holy Ghost also is a witness to us: for after that he had said before,
16This is the covenant that I will make with them after those days, saith the Lord, I will put my laws into their hearts, and in their minds will I write them;
17And their sins and iniquities will I remember no more.
18Now where remission of these is, there is no more offering for sin.
19Having therefore, brethren, boldness to enter into the holiest by the blood of Jesus,
20By a new and living way, which he hath consecrated for us, through the veil, that is to say, his flesh;
21And having an high priest over the house of God;
22Let us draw near with a true heart in full assurance of faith, having our hearts sprinkled from an evil conscience, and our bodies washed with pure water.
23Let us hold fast the profession of our faith without wavering; (for he is faithful that promised;)
24And let us consider one another to provoke unto love and to good works:
25Not forsaking the assembling of ourselves together, as the manner of some is; but exhorting one another: and so much the more, as ye see the day approaching.
26For if we sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins,
27But a certain fearful looking for of judgment and fiery indignation, which shall devour the adversaries.
28He that despised Moses' law died without mercy under two or three witnesses:
29Of how much sorer punishment, suppose ye, shall he be thought worthy, who hath trodden under foot the Son of God, and hath counted the blood of the covenant, wherewith he was sanctified, an unholy thing, and hath done despite unto the Spirit of grace?
30For we know him that hath said, Vengeance belongeth unto me, I will recompense, saith the Lord. And again, The Lord shall judge his people.
31It is a fearful thing to fall into the hands of the living God.
32But call to remembrance the former days, in which, after ye were illuminated, ye endured a great fight of afflictions;
33Partly, whilst ye were made a gazingstock both by reproaches and afflictions; and partly, whilst ye became companions of them that were so used.
34For ye had compassion of me in my bonds, and took joyfully the spoiling of your goods, knowing in yourselves that ye have in heaven a better and an enduring substance.
35Cast not away therefore your confidence, which hath great recompence of reward.
36For ye have need of patience, that, after ye have done the will of God, ye might receive the promise.
37For yet a little while, and he that shall come will come, and will not tarry.
38Now the just shall live by faith: but if any man draw back, my soul shall have no pleasure in him.
39But we are not of them who draw back unto perdition; but of them that believe to the saving of the soul.
Pray for those folks who are caught up in this false religious system to be born again and start following Christ rather than a sinner dressed up in flowing robes and a big hat...amen?
Monty O'Toole
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