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RE: Natural Childbirth-support and discussion - 5/10/2008 10:58:40 AM
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lilyofthefield
Posts: 1294
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From: The Dark Side of the Moon - yeah, I'm a Floyd fan.
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Kathryn, no matter what you do, someone will think it's wrong or weird, so you do what is best for you! I'm having a hospital birth, but trying to go natural - people look at me weird for that. I've had several people tell me or my husband that I need to get the epidural. It seems unwanted advice just comes with the territory. 
QUESTION: Baby is always rotating between ROA and ROP. I cannot get him to move to OA or LOA. I'm confused because some say to do the inversions, sitting forward, crawling, etc to encourage him, but I've also read that if he refuses to move that way (he does) that it may be a cord issue and he really needs to turn all the way around (roa-rop-lop-loa). Should I even be trying to get him in a better position or just leave everything alone? It seems he is having real trouble dropping any further where he is, and he just seems "stuck".
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Caden is here!
A boy is Truth with dirt on its face, Beauty with a cut on its finger, Wisdom with bubble gum in its hair and the Hope of the future with a frog in its pocket. - Alan Beck
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RE: Natural Childbirth-support and discussion - 5/10/2008 1:32:36 PM
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PrincessDonna
Posts: 10542
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From: Cow country, Upstate NY
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Kathryn, I've never homebirthed, nor will I ever because of the medical problems I have had. But I have lots of friends that have. The most recent one told only a handful of people their plan because she didn't want to hear anything negative. I say just pick who needs to know or who YOU want to know and don't bring it up to the rest.
Lily, how can you tell exactly how the baby is??? I mean, I've known that the baby was posterior because of bad back pain and where the kicks were, but to know all four of those positions...how? I would not worry about it. Your baby still has plenty of time to turn "right". I had one that didn't turn from posterior until late in labor, and I myself was born posterior with a completely natural birth and no complications for my mom.
_____________________________
For I will pour water on the thirsty land,
and streams on the dry ground;
I will pour out my Spirit on your offspring,
and my blessing on your descendants.
~Isaiah 44:3~
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RE: Natural Childbirth-support and discussion - 5/10/2008 1:40:07 PM
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Jenny-Fair
Posts: 6231
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From: WA
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quote:
Kathryn, I've never homebirthed, nor will I ever because of the medical problems I have had. But I have lots of friends that have. The most recent one told only a handful of people their plan because she didn't want to hear anything negative. I say just pick who needs to know or who YOU want to know and don't bring it up to the rest.
That is very wise advice.
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RE: Natural Childbirth-support and discussion - 5/10/2008 2:35:21 PM
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HomeSpunLady
Posts: 1106
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From: Lovely Pennsylvania!
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I talked with the m/w again and I really like what I hear. Most of what she tells me is what I have been reading. Hubby had me ask two questions he had and I think he will be good with those answers. I hope so.
Only one thing, I feel really bad about this and it's not like its my fault. Her husband was killed in this area in an accident just last december. She hasn't been up here since. She knew this day would come and was preparing herself. She's going to be bringing someone with her to the appts, which is fine, just so she has some support. My heart breaks for her. I love my husband.
If hubby is good with the answers she gave, I think we are going to do this. Oh wow, I think I might actually have a homebirth!! Can you imagine? Birthing this baby in our home. I won't have to worry about 'going' home. We will be home. Oh I like it. I really really like it.
Did I mention she has a pool she brings along? That means it will be a waterbirth! Cool. Please continue to pray!! I am still seeking out His plan and although I would be disappointed, I would go willingly to a practice if that's where He leads me. My desire is for a homebirth, though.
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Kathryn
Just Me
Second bun in the oven
28 weeks - Due Sept 24
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RE: Natural Childbirth-support and discussion - 5/10/2008 2:39:27 PM
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PrincessDonna
Posts: 10542
Joined: 4/11/2005
From: Cow country, Upstate NY
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quote:
Only one thing, I feel really bad about this and it's not like its my fault. Her husband was killed in this area in an accident just last december. She hasn't been up here since. She knew this day would come and was preparing herself. She's going to be bringing someone with her to the appts, which is fine, just so she has some support. My heart breaks for her. I love my husband.
What an amazing God-incidence...how perfect for her to be delivering a pastor's baby. I will pray you and your husband will be able to be a blessing to this woman, and to be God's hands on earth to help her heart heal.
I'm so excited for you and I hope this works out!
_____________________________
For I will pour water on the thirsty land,
and streams on the dry ground;
I will pour out my Spirit on your offspring,
and my blessing on your descendants.
~Isaiah 44:3~
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RE: Natural Childbirth-support and discussion - 5/10/2008 2:50:54 PM
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HomeSpunLady
Posts: 1106
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From: Lovely Pennsylvania!
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Donna, I thought that too. I don't want to be presumptuous, but how honoring to be used in such a way.
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Kathryn
Just Me
Second bun in the oven
28 weeks - Due Sept 24
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RE: Natural Childbirth-support and discussion - 5/10/2008 4:57:49 PM
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Royal.Fortress
Posts: 2262
Joined: 8/11/2005
From: Ontario
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quote:
Why are/did you do it?
Of all the research I've done, everything points to homebirth being as safe or more safe than hospital birth for low-risk pregnancies. Also, like Jenny said, the safest place is often the place where mom feels most comfortable - and I do *not* feel comfortable giving birth in a hospital. I believe that birth, although unpredictable, is (in most circumstances) a normal physiological process that is best when left untampered with. (Arg for ending a sentence in a preposition, but I couldn't figure out how to word it differently). I feel like going to the hospital is setting myself up for unnecessary intervention and I truly feel that I will be able to handle the pain and hard work of childbirth better in the safety and comfort of my own home.
quote:
What makes/made you think you could do it?
Generations of women before us did it! Women around the world continue to do it and are OKAY. Yes, medical science is important and I believe in modern obstetrics, but I also believe that God knew what he was doing when he designed our bodies and our babies and that for the most part, they work just fine  (something like 300 000 babies are born every day ... so on the day you're giving birth, 299 999 other women are doing it too!!)
quote:
What would you suggest to someone who is seriously thinking of doing it?
Read, read, read! Read about natural childbirth, read about homebirth, read to make yourself informed about all the interventions. It's important that you arm yourself with knowledge both to prepare you for labour/birth and so that you are knowledgeable if the need to go to the hospital arrives so that you can make informed decisions at that point. Talk to other women who've done it (I'm sure you could ask your m/w to put you in contact with women), watch birth videos to accustom yourself to the sights/sounds of labour and birth, and most of all, PRAY and BELIEVE IN YOUR BODY. Look at your fears and hopes seriously and come to terms with them - especially the fear part. Deal with any fears you can before hand so that they won't come up during labour.
quote:
How do you handle the questions and weird looks?
I answer people honestly and openly and am not afraid to quote statistics at them! I tell people why we're doing it and, for the most part, people are very respectful - although most are not supportive 
quote:
QUESTION: Baby is always rotating between ROA and ROP. I cannot get him to move to OA or LOA. I'm confused because some say to do the inversions, sitting forward, crawling, etc to encourage him, but I've also read that if he refuses to move that way (he does) that it may be a cord issue and he really needs to turn all the way around (roa-rop-lop-loa). Should I even be trying to get him in a better position or just leave everything alone? It seems he is having real trouble dropping any further where he is, and he just seems "stuck".
Lily - I wish I knew!! June Bug is doing the same thing - is either ROA or ROP, but definitely doesn't stay ROA!!! I'm hoping to ask my midwives about this on Monday, so hopefully I can get an answer for you!! I think one thing to do is, when you're sure Caden is ROA, do lots of squatting to help him descend into your pelvis. Remember, though, he might just be a late dropper!
_____________________________
Kim
my blog -> kim thru the looking glass
Gwen has arrived!!! Born June 12, 2008 =)
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RE: Natural Childbirth-support and discussion - 5/10/2008 5:34:24 PM
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HomeSpunLady
Posts: 1106
Joined: 4/12/2005
From: Lovely Pennsylvania!
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Well, I talked with hubby and he is satisfied with what the mw responded with. We will have an interview with her just to meet and see how we all feel around each other, but hubby and I are both a go on our end and so is the midwife. Barring some bad feeling or whatever, it looks like we are on our way to a homebirth!!
Ok, book time...What books do I need to read?
_____________________________
Kathryn
Just Me
Second bun in the oven
28 weeks - Due Sept 24
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RE: Natural Childbirth-support and discussion - 5/10/2008 6:44:16 PM
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Jenny-Fair
Posts: 6231
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From: WA
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quote:
Of all the research I've done, everything points to homebirth being as safe or more safe than hospital birth for low-risk pregnancies. As a post c-section mom, I was actually not low-risk. I still felt it was safer to be at home-where everyone around me was not basically thinking, 'we'll just let her be miserable long enough until we can do a c-section', basically rooting for my failure, assuming things about my body, etc.
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RE: Natural Childbirth-support and discussion - 5/10/2008 7:53:07 PM
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Mrs.Wifey
Posts: 4935
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From: The Gorgeous plains of Colorado
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Jenny-Fair
quote:
Of all the research I've done, everything points to homebirth being as safe or more safe than hospital birth for low-risk pregnancies. As a post c-section mom, I was actually not low-risk. I still felt it was safer to be at home-where everyone around me was not basically thinking, 'we'll just let her be miserable long enough until we can do a c-section', basically rooting for my failure, assuming things about my body, etc.
I would consider a VBAC safer then say, Pre-E though as far as home birthing goes.
_____________________________
Ryanne Gabriella Alexis born 8-22-07!
The opinions stated in the above post are solely mine and in no way should they be
construed as offensive due to your own insecurity.
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RE: Natural Childbirth-support and discussion - 5/10/2008 7:55:50 PM
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Jenny-Fair
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From: WA
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Yes and no...after all, they were willing to let you birth vaginally, but they were unwilling to let me do so.
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RE: Natural Childbirth-support and discussion - 5/10/2008 8:23:03 PM
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Mrs.Wifey
Posts: 4935
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Right, but we both know that the risk of uterine rupture during a VBAC(especially a non-medicated one) is MUCH lower then risk of seizure or stroke with Pre-E.
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Ryanne Gabriella Alexis born 8-22-07!
The opinions stated in the above post are solely mine and in no way should they be
construed as offensive due to your own insecurity.
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RE: Natural Childbirth-support and discussion - 5/10/2008 8:33:20 PM
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Jenny-Fair
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Oh, I agree, I am just pointing out that many of the dangers lie not in naturally-occurring malfunctions, but in the attitudes of the medical care providers.
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RE: Natural Childbirth-support and discussion - 5/10/2008 10:17:14 PM
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peculiar_lady2
Posts: 12194
Joined: 2/11/2007
From: Between Hither and Yon
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quote:
Ok, book time...What books do I need to read?
this is a repost of the list that smooches has previously posted:
“The Thinking Woman's Guide to a Better Birth” by Henci Goer - wonderfully written, though, like her other books, it is a little on the weighty side with information (just up my alley). She writes a comprehensive study guide, in very lay-friendly wording, to the medical studies - and why medical studies themselves support NCB without saying so. Fully referencable.
”Birthing from Within” by Pam England - a spiritual journey into the beauty and self-power of childbirth. A little on the hippy side, but I love her poetic writing and no-holds-barred approach to the act of childbirth. New Ageness is a trip though and clashes with Christianity on many levels.
“Guide to Childbirth” by Ina May Gaskin - MY FAVORITE right now. I have read it around 5 times since buy it 9 months ago. Traditional midwifery meets practical application and psychological connection of mind-body. It is full of inspiring birth stories. Her holistic approach to childbirth is refreshing and challenges even the most staunch NCB advocate to trade in their biases just a little more for faith in the miraculous art of birthing.
"Childbirth Without Fear" by Grantly Dick-Read - the pioneer book on childbirth. Written in the early 1900's, the predecessor to Dr. Ferdinand Lamaze and Dr. Robert Bradley, he coins the fear-pain-tension cycle and teaches effective means of breaking that cycle. A revolutionary book, full of history, and a difficult read.
“Husband Coached Childbirth” by Dr. Robert Bradley - originally written in the 1950's, it is a strong book on the Bradley Method - it's history, teachings, and beliefs. It is written in the perspective for the coach and can be a bit chauvenistic, but it is another wonderfully informative read on how laboring animals can teach us how we, as higher species, can eliminate unneccessary pain and discomfort in childbirth by modelling after their behavior and stages of laboring.
“Christ Centered Childbirth” by Kelly J. Townsend - the teachings of Robert Bradley from a Christian POV. Keeping creation and God's design as the forefront and premises for all teachings.
“The Labor Progress Handbook” by Penny Simkin - delving into such sticky situations as dystocia and failure to progress, Penny meets the challenge of reasons given for cesarean deliveries. This book focuses on simple non-invasive interventions to prevent or treat difficult labor. It describes positions, movements and techniques based on principles of anatomy, physiology and psychology of childbirth. This handbook is organized by stage of labor for easy reference. The rationale for all techniques is included based on the authors' clinical experience and wherever possible on the underlying evidence base.
"Natural Chilbirth the Bradley Way" by Susan McCutcheon - written as a follow-up to HCC, this informative and preferred book of the Bradley Method delves into the differences of Bradley vs. 'other methods', the emotional signposts of labor, the physical makeup of labor and birth, and common-sense approaches to relaxation and relief in labor. Filled with relaxation practices and consumer-friendly wisdom, it is a wonderful walking handbook for any NCB student.
"The Pregnancy Book" by Dr. Sears - written as a month-by-month guide, it is an excellent all-in-one guide to pregnancy. This book deals with physical and emotional changes, describes the growth of the fetus, and discusses common concerns during pregnancy. It also focuses on nutrition, exercise, information and support for home births and birthing centers, traveling while pregnant, how to avoid episiotomy, and so on. The approach is gentle, thorough, and includes more information than most month-by-month guides.
"The Birth Book" by Dr. Sears - written as a helpful resource guide, this book covers the gamut of possibilities, and teaches what every woman needs to know to take control of their own birth. It is divided into three parts: "Preparing for Birth," "Easing Pain in Labor," and "Experiencing Birth." Each section outlines options and medical studies supporting a positive birth experience. It details vaginal births; cesareans; VBACs; water births; home births; best birthing positions; drugs; pain; how to design your own birth plan; sexuality of birth; and lots of birth stories. Unbiased and research based, it is a positive companion in working toward informed consent.
"Having a Baby, naturally" by Mothering Mag. - a wonderful book written by the publishers of Mothering Magazine. It contains pregnancy nutrition (and recipes), exercise, childbirth choices, methods of NCB, positions, and postpartum guidance (including newborn care). An easy read and nice referencial guide, I recommend it!
"Immaculate Deception" by Suzanne Arms - very readable, yet historically inaccurate when talking of anything beyond childbirth (ie, her christianity rant), Ms Arms presents a moving work on the loss of childbirth faith in present culture and throughout history. Validating women mourning 'loss of birth', this book confronts the issues surrounding the American culture, our loss of faith in our bodies design and nature's intent, and medical conspiracy to keep the power in the hands of the medical field and money markets themselves.
"The Womanly Art of Breastfeeding" by LLL Int. - My favorite book on breastfeeding. A little heavier a read than the Breastfeeding Book, but written from the experts on breastfeeding themselves. It is a great companion for encouragement and information to all breastfeeding mothers and those anticipating breastfeeding. Study-based information and support for common difficulties faced in breastfeeding, it is a must-have.
"The Baby Catcher" by Peggy Vincent - written autobiographically, this book follows one woman's walk through her midwifery career. Filled with childbirth stories and history, the politics faced in the midwifery field, and the ups and downs of the business, this is a delightful and insightful read for liesure and enlightenment (not much in the way for NCB prep though).
“Spiritual Midwifery” by Ina May Gaskin - This book includes updated information on the safety of natural childbirth, birthing stories, and the most recent statistics on births managed by The Farm Midwives. Also presents stories of working with Amish women, showing a different culture with a similar appreciation for natural childbirth. It is more 'religious' in it's approach and can be slightly yuppy in conveyance, but a classic read for NCB advocates none-the-less.
"The Politics of Birth" by Sheila Kitzinger - WOW. thats all I have to say. The Politics of Birth explores ways in which we learn about birth, how we talk and feel about it, assumptions that professional caregivers may make, and the roles and skills of midwives. Topics include home birth and water birth; the use of drugs in childbirth; obstetric and nursing interventions which are often used routinely; Caesarean sections; pressures that care-givers are under, and the choices presented to women that are more apparent than real. Throughout, the author draws on research-based evidence to present both an holistic yet grounded examination of topical issues surrounding pregnancy and childbirth. This is not a "how to" book. The aim of The Politics of Birth is to help the reader develop deeper insight and understanding of how a technocratic birth culture shapes our ideas about birth and obstetric practice.
"The Complete Book of Pregnancy and Childbirth" by Sheila Kitzinger - Here, candidly and reasonably presented, is all the information expectant parents need to make their own decisions about everything--from which tests to allow to how to handle pain to where to give birth. Very similar in presentation to the Birth Book. Less biased than other NCB books, but just as informative and fact-based.
"The Breastfeeding Book" by Martha Sears - a comprehensive very reader-friendly guide to what to expect while breastfeeing, the challenges that are commonly faced both physically and socially, and the benefits/physiology of breastfeeding.
"The Birth Partner" by Penny Simkin - This book gives the birth partner a clear understanding of the process of bearing a baby and the role that he or she is to play. Simkin thoroughly examines parturition, from essential supplies for mother and baby to how to handle an emergency delivery. At her best, Simkin makes the birth partner aware of medical decisions that may lie ahead and of the importance of indulging the mother with constant tender loving care and encouragement during labor and delivery.
"The Doula Book" by Marshall Klaus - a Greek word that means "woman caregiver", this book talks about the importance and role of the doula in today's society, while touching on the historocity of the role as well. Doula has come to mean an experienced labor companion who provides parents-to-be with emotional and physical support during labor, delivery and, to some extent, postpartum; describing how a doula can help the birthing process, detailing studies that indicate doula-supported births result in a major reduction in the length of labor, a greater than 50% drop in cesarean sections, a decrease in a mother's need for pain medication and fewer feeding problems for babies after birth, this book is educational when considering a doula. Very easy reading.
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"Some [babies] are just so inexplicably persnickety and unpleasing that it's easy to imagine that they were not actually floating in amniotic fluid but in pickle juice!" -Maggie (3cappuccinosmom)
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RE: Natural Childbirth-support and discussion - 5/12/2008 9:26:38 PM
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lilyofthefield
Posts: 1294
Joined: 4/21/2006
From: The Dark Side of the Moon - yeah, I'm a Floyd fan.
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Makes sense to me. Did she seem concerned at all about ROA as opposed to LOA? This kid is not going to go LOA, but is staying ROA consistantly now.
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Caden is here!
A boy is Truth with dirt on its face, Beauty with a cut on its finger, Wisdom with bubble gum in its hair and the Hope of the future with a frog in its pocket. - Alan Beck
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RE: Natural Childbirth-support and discussion - 5/13/2008 12:07:00 PM
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Royal.Fortress
Posts: 2262
Joined: 8/11/2005
From: Ontario
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They didn't seem concerned about that at all, actually!
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Kim
my blog -> kim thru the looking glass
Gwen has arrived!!! Born June 12, 2008 =)
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RE: Natural Childbirth-support and discussion - 5/13/2008 1:11:58 PM
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peculiar_lady2
Posts: 12194
Joined: 2/11/2007
From: Between Hither and Yon
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yes it is totally normal for some babies to move up and down during the last stretch of the pregnancy. Some keep doing that even into labor and up until transition when they fully engage and finally settle into the down position.
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"Some [babies] are just so inexplicably persnickety and unpleasing that it's easy to imagine that they were not actually floating in amniotic fluid but in pickle juice!" -Maggie (3cappuccinosmo | | |
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