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RE: Is Barack Obama a Christian? - 3/23/2008 6:36:01 PM
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lightshineon
Posts: 3359
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I think he said anemia, he must have some sort of condition that taxes all his strength. I do not mind money for disabilites such as this. Now my brother and SIL, who are mentally ill could work, infact, it makes thier condition worse, because they drink, drug it, all day and fantazize about the FBI being after them. They make a good disability, but not working has given them a lock of hope and poupose. I think I can agree with you Tom, and RC on this one, but not all of the folks on disability. Blessings. Bo needs to look at all the factors, not one size fits all, which many Dems do.
_____________________________
Remember, whenever you have pearls, there are always plenty of pigs nearby who would be glad to step on them.
F.T., 2007
Be sure you vote for those, whose views you want your children to emulate.
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RE: Is Barack Obama a Christian? - 3/23/2008 7:00:11 PM
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TomTurn
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quote:
I think he said anemia, he must have some sort of condition that taxes all his strength.
Pardon me. I at times suffer from RTF (reading to fast) syndrome (-:
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RE: Is Barack Obama a Christian? - 3/23/2008 7:01:54 PM
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lightshineon
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I suffer that too. (LOL)
quote:
ORIGINAL: TomTurn
quote:
I think he said anemia, he must have some sort of condition that taxes all his strength.
Pardon me. I at times suffer from RTF (reading to fast) syndrome (-:
_____________________________
Remember, whenever you have pearls, there are always plenty of pigs nearby who would be glad to step on them.
F.T., 2007
Be sure you vote for those, whose views you want your children to emulate.
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RE: Is Barack Obama a Christian? - 3/23/2008 8:21:38 PM
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rcjames
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From: Oklahoma
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quote:
ORIGINAL: lightshineon
Pardon me. I at times suffer from RTF (reading to fast) syndrome (-:
I honestly think that there are very few folks that could not do some kind of productive word. There is plenty of work at home (computer, telephone, etc.) for folks that cannot get out.
But when you can get the gov. to pay you, then why put out the effore. I bet those that "Can't get out" will be "Out" voting for Obama and a shot to increase their monthly stipend.
Thsnks
RC
_____________________________
Just a country Preacher's humble opinion
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RE: Is Barack Obama a Christian? - 3/23/2008 8:44:00 PM
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lightshineon
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You know, I do not know about everyone, I am sure it is hard to find jobs with disabilities. Especially some, with people having such a broad range of different disabilites. Though, it should be in alot of cases working for the disability check, job supplied by Goverment. Though like I said, the range is so broad, we cannot lump everyone togather, True my Brother is a BO fan. I cannot judge anyone person though, it is not my job, they have people who do that.
quote:
ORIGINAL: rcjames
quote:
ORIGINAL: lightshineon
Pardon me. I at times suffer from RTF (reading to fast) syndrome (-:
I honestly think that there are very few folks that could not do some kind of productive word. There is plenty of work at home (computer, telephone, etc.) for folks that cannot get out.
But when you can get the gov. to pay you, then why put out the effore. I bet those that "Can't get out" will be "Out" voting for Obama and a shot to increase their monthly stipend.
Thsnks
RC
_____________________________
Remember, whenever you have pearls, there are always plenty of pigs nearby who would be glad to step on them.
F.T., 2007
Be sure you vote for those, whose views you want your children to emulate.
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RE: Is Barack Obama a Christian? - 3/23/2008 8:52:40 PM
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rainbowtvp
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From: The Unted State of Confusion
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quote:
ORIGINAL: rcjames
quote:
ORIGINAL: jkdjr25
Inherrantly Christian position:
quote:
While he supports a lot of social programs, he also really encourages personal responsibility.
Non-Christian position: Suck it up and get a job.
There you go.
Wow, I thought the New Testament tells us that if you don't work you don't eat.
(2Th 3:10) For even when we were with you, this we commanded you, that if any would not work, neither should he eat.
Which translation do you use that supports your liberal postion.
Thanks
RC
I think you ignored to bolded part.
I would say "Suck it up and get a job" and "Here, take whatever you want" could both be considered non-Christian responses.
But, Obama promotes enough social programs to keep people out of poverty (because otherwise people feel hopeless) and programs that encourage and require people to take personal responsibility.
Tara P
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RE: Is Barack Obama a Christian? - 3/23/2008 10:02:49 PM
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TomTurn
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quote:
Obama promotes enough social programs to keep people out of poverty (because otherwise people feel hopeless) and programs that encourage and require people to take personal responsibility.
Not the governments job which is why all "programs" are failures
_____________________________
TomTurn, "a typical white person from a small town but not in a Christian nation, who clings to God, owns guns, actually listened to the pastor for 22 years, whose life did start at conception and whose mother was punished with 3 babies"
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RE: Is Barack Obama a Christian? - 3/24/2008 1:41:24 AM
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relady
Posts: 961
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From: Greater St. Louis Metro
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quote:
It seems that every time the gov. tries to get the welfare/disabled folks to do work they can do to recieve the givaways; the libs run to sue and just want the welfare money. boy I wish I knew where all this "welfare money" is that people are receiving. There hasn't been actual MONEY available for people in Missouri for I don't know how long. And if you have any kind of regular job, it will almost certainly make you ineligible for food stamps or medicaid. So just where are all these people who are sitting around getting these huge welfare checks? Just curious.
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RE: Is Barack Obama a Christian? - 3/24/2008 8:18:41 AM
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P31W
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quote:
So just where are all these people who are sitting around getting these huge welfare checks? Just curious.
Come to Mississippi and I will show you. In FACT I will show you many who live on my road who are multi-generational.
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RE: Is Barack Obama a Christian? - 3/24/2008 10:16:39 AM
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relady
Posts: 961
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quote:
Come to Mississippi and I will show you. In FACT I will show you many who live on my road who are multi-generational. They must be getting state money, then cause the Feds only have TANF and the most you can get from TANF is like less than $300 a month. And you can't get that if you have any kind of job that pays anything. It is sad that some people would rather live in poverty that try to find a way out. But, like you said, it does become generational and when you're raised that way you think that's what's "normal" I guess. Never understood that thinking, but that's just me. I just find it hard to believe there are many people that wouldn't take a clear way out if it was offered and they could reasonably take it.
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RE: Is Barack Obama a Christian? - 3/24/2008 10:18:19 AM
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rcjames
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quote:
ORIGINAL: rainbowtvp
But, Obama promotes enough social programs to keep people out of poverty (because otherwise people feel hopeless) and programs that encourage and require people to take personal responsibility.
For over 40 years the "Great Society" has been doing this, and it is an utter failure. There are more "Folks feeling hopeless" or feeling sorry for themselves than at the beginning.
Now Obama and Clinton want to expand this failure into a mega-failure.
Thanks
RC
_____________________________
Just a country Preacher's humble opinion
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RE: Is Barack Obama a Christian? - 3/24/2008 10:40:23 AM
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rainbowtvp
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quote:
ORIGINAL: rcjames
quote:
ORIGINAL: rainbowtvp
But, Obama promotes enough social programs to keep people out of poverty (because otherwise people feel hopeless) and programs that encourage and require people to take personal responsibility.
For over 40 years the "Great Society" has been doing this, and it is an utter failure. There are more "Folks feeling hopeless" or feeling sorry for themselves than at the beginning.
Now Obama and Clinton want to expand this failure into a mega-failure.
Thanks
RC
I don't have the stats handy, but did you know... most people on welfare are getting assitance for less than 2 years? And most (like 80%) recieving benefits like food stamps and med assistance have jobs!
Most people who spend time on welfare end up gainfully employed- either by getting better jobs through increased experience or through education/training.
Most who don't are either have a physical or mental illness or substance addiction. Getting them out can be harder- but improving the mental health & substance use services and making more training opportunities available can help.
Note, too, many military personnel from Iraq are coming home injured or suffering from PTSD. We need to improve the services available to them and make them available immediately so that they can re-enter society with dignity.
Tara P
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RE: Is Barack Obama a Christian? - 3/24/2008 10:44:18 AM
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jkdjr25
Posts: 726
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From: Michigan
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quote:
ORIGINAL: rainbowtvp
quote:
ORIGINAL: rcjames
quote:
ORIGINAL: rainbowtvp
But, Obama promotes enough social programs to keep people out of poverty (because otherwise people feel hopeless) and programs that encourage and require people to take personal responsibility.
For over 40 years the "Great Society" has been doing this, and it is an utter failure. There are more "Folks feeling hopeless" or feeling sorry for themselves than at the beginning.
Now Obama and Clinton want to expand this failure into a mega-failure.
Thanks
RC
I don't have the stats handy, but did you know... most people on welfare are getting assitance for less than 2 years? And most (like 80%) recieving benefits like food stamps and med assistance have jobs!
Most people who spend time on welfare end up gainfully employed- either by getting better jobs through increased experience or through education/training.
Most who don't are either have a physical or mental illness or substance addiction. Getting them out can be harder- but improving the mental health & substance use services and making more training opportunities available can help.
Note, too, many military personnel from Iraq are coming home injured or suffering from PTSD. We need to improve the services available to them and make them available immediately so that they can re-enter society with dignity.
Tara P
*nods*
This is true. And like I said earlier it's not that a lot of them don't want to work, a majority of them do. It's that some, myself included for various health reasons, can't work. We shouldn't look down on people who aren't able to work and we shouldn't drag the programs that help them through the mud.
_____________________________
I reject your reality and subsitute my own.- Adam Savage, Mythbusters
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RE: Is Barack Obama a Christian? - 3/24/2008 12:25:17 PM
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lightshineon
Posts: 3359
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well I do not jkdjr25, I really do not.
quote:
ORIGINAL: jkdjr25
quote:
ORIGINAL: rainbowtvp
quote:
ORIGINAL: rcjames
quote:
ORIGINAL: rainbowtvp
But, Obama promotes enough social programs to keep people out of poverty (because otherwise people feel hopeless) and programs that encourage and require people to take personal responsibility.
For over 40 years the "Great Society" has been doing this, and it is an utter failure. There are more "Folks feeling hopeless" or feeling sorry for themselves than at the beginning.
Now Obama and Clinton want to expand this failure into a mega-failure.
Thanks
RC
I don't have the stats handy, but did you know... most people on welfare are getting assitance for less than 2 years? And most (like 80%) recieving benefits like food stamps and med assistance have jobs!
Most people who spend time on welfare end up gainfully employed- either by getting better jobs through increased experience or through education/training.
Most who don't are either have a physical or mental illness or substance addiction. Getting them out can be harder- but improving the mental health & substance use services and making more training opportunities available can help.
Note, too, many military personnel from Iraq are coming home injured or suffering from PTSD. We need to improve the services available to them and make them available immediately so that they can re-enter society with dignity.
Tara P
*nods*
This is true. And like I said earlier it's not that a lot of them don't want to work, a majority of them do. It's that some, myself included for various health reasons, can't work. We shouldn't look down on people who aren't able to work and we shouldn't drag the programs that help them through the mud.
_____________________________
Remember, whenever you have pearls, there are always plenty of pigs nearby who would be glad to step on them.
F.T., 2007
Be sure you vote for those, whose views you want your children to emulate.
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RE: Is Barack Obama a Christian? - 3/24/2008 1:14:46 PM
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P31W
Posts: 2027
Joined: 6/13/2005
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quote:
And you can't get that if you have any kind of job that pays anything
Most people here on welfare who "earn income" don't report the income. They will either set up a business for themselves and simply not show a dime of income or they will do other illegal activity inorder to make money when they want it. (drugs/prostitution/take orders for stolen items/etc.)
Most people who are involved in landscape, babysitting, housekeeping and the like around here simply don't report a dime of the money they earn.
Most people who want to "use" the system have no problem breaking the law. Most of the people on my road have spent time in prison. The people who use the system on my road look and live not much differant than the people who work 40-50 hrs per week. They "laugh" at those people who are honest and do an honest days work.
________
I don't like the government being the ones who decide who is able bodied, who is able to find a job and who is not. I had rather do what God told us to do in scripture and have each church decide who in their community is in need of help and the church helping them. Then those of "us" who live in those communities and who "know the truth" are able to use our money more wisely and those who are truly in need will get the help they need. Those who are lazy can go hungry.
< Message edited by P31W -- 3/24/2008 1:24:47 PM >
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RE: Is Barack Obama a Christian? - 3/24/2008 4:06:59 PM
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kvonnegut
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I just wanted to add that it is pretty hard to actually recieve money from the federal government under TANF. Most people who come in to apply for it get turned down because they simply own a car...
Most people who critize any help from our government don't fully understand the strict laws that are put into place to try to keep people from getting assistance from our government. In the past several years there has been a big move towards faith based initiatives, and while some christians are quick to slam the governments help, they are supportive of the faith based initiatives. Under Faith based nitiatives federal money goes to churches who do not have to disclose financial information to anybody to do things which helps the public. I don't really see the difference between gov't welfare and Faith based initiatives.
So which is better Faith based nitiatives or TANF? Why?
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RE: Is Barack Obama a Christian? - 3/24/2008 4:12:37 PM
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jkdjr25
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Joined: 2/19/2008
From: Michigan
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Personally I'm not entirely comfortable with Governments getting involved with any religion. It almost never ends well.
I'd like to see the Church getting involved without asking the Government for money. I'd also like to see the programs that are supposed to help people continue.
_____________________________
I reject your reality and subsitute my own.- Adam Savage, Mythbusters
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RE: Is Barack Obama a Christian? - 3/24/2008 5:01:31 PM
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relady
Posts: 961
Joined: 4/11/2005
From: Greater St. Louis Metro
Status: offline
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P31W, maybe you should call and report some of those people you KNOW are manipulating the system. I think that's what I would do. At the very least, it might spark some investigation into what they are doing or not doing. With any system there will be people who manipulate and use the system, but I don't like throwing the baby out with the bathwater. I don't believe people like this are in the majority. In fact, I'd say they are a visible minority that ruins it for everyone who truly needs assistance.
Here in MO, I fed and housed a young single mother (friend of my son's) and in the entire time she was with us (1 year) she did not get one single dime in actual money. She got foodstamps, WIC and medicaid until she got a job paying 7.50 an hour. Then they took it all away cause she made too much money. Never mind she wasn't making enough to even get an apartment. Her first year being a mother opened my eyes to what a horrendous, unhelpful system we have that truly needs some overhaul. If she hadn't had us, she would have been living in a shelter with her baby because she got fired while she was pregnant because of sickness so she didn't have a decent job. It was awful for her and I wouldn't wish that on my worst enemy. Well....wait....maybe for a little while..... 
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RE: Is Barack Obama a Christian? - 3/24/2008 6:01:10 PM
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lightshineon
Posts: 3359
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huh?
quote:
ORIGINAL: jkdjr25
Personally I'm not entirely comfortable with Governments getting involved with any religion. It almost never ends well.
I'd like to see the Church getting involved without asking the Government for money. I'd also like to see the programs that are supposed to help people continue.
_____________________________
Remember, whenever you have pearls, there are always plenty of pigs nearby who would be glad to step on them.
F.T., 2007
Be sure you vote for those, whose views you want your children to emulate.
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RE: Is Barack Obama a Christian? - 3/24/2008 6:37:07 PM
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rcjames
Posts: 4836
Joined: 7/15/2005
From: Oklahoma
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: jkdjr25
Personally I'm not entirely comfortable with Governments getting involved with any religion. It almost never ends well.
I'd like to see the Church getting involved without asking the Government for money. ...
Please, please, please, let me take this opportunity to agree with you on the above statement.
Thanks
RC
_____________________________
Just a country Preacher's humble opinion
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RE: Is Barack Obama a Christian? No! - 3/27/2008 9:57:41 PM
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jimbob1
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Joined: 3/16/2008
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Obama contends belief in Jesus Christ not necessary for salvation
AP - 3/27/2008 8:00:00 AM
GREENSBORO, N.C. - Senator Barack Obama has told an audience that although he believes Christ died for his sins, those who reject that teaching can also be children of God.
During a campaign stop yesterday in Greensboro, North Carolina, Senator Obama told the audience that he believes he "can have everlasting life" because Jesus Christ died for his sins. But he then told a questioner that he believes Jews and Muslims who live moral lives are just as much "children of God" as he is. (listen to audio clip)
The Illinois Democrat added that his late mother didn't share his faith but was a kind and generous person, so he's "sure she's in heaven." (listen to audio clip)
http://www.onenewsnow.com/Election2008/Default.aspx?id=73553
I doubt that The Obamas are saved????
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RE: Is Barack Obama a Christian? No! - 3/28/2008 1:02:57 AM
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wing2000
Posts: 904
Joined: 4/14/2005
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quote:
During a campaign stop yesterday in Greensboro, North Carolina, Senator Obama told the audience that he believes he "can have everlasting life" because Jesus Christ died for his sins. But he then told a questioner that he believes Jews and Muslims who live moral lives are just as much "children of God" as he is.
Jimbob,
...and of course President BUsh has said essentially the same thing...yet I don't see you attacking his faith. Why is that?
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RE: Is Barack Obama a Christian? No! - 3/28/2008 8:19:52 AM
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lightshineon
Posts: 3359
Joined: 4/11/2005
Status: offline
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Well both better get it right, they are not going to make it themselves if they don't. Now wing are thou happy?
quote:
ORIGINAL: wing2000
quote:
During a campaign stop yesterday in Greensboro, North Carolina, Senator Obama told the audience that he believes he "can have everlasting life" because Jesus Christ died for his sins. But he then told a questioner that he believes Jews and Muslims who live moral lives are just as much "children of God" as he is.
Jimbob,
...and of course President BUsh has said essentially the same thing...yet I don't see you attacking his faith. Why is that?
< Message edited by lightshineon -- 3/28/2008 10:11:56 AM >
_____________________________
Remember, whenever you have pearls, there are always plenty of pigs nearby who would be glad to step on them.
F.T., 2007
Be sure you vote for those, whose views you want your children to emulate.
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RE: Is Barack Obama a Christian? - 3/28/2008 9:48:48 AM
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P31W
Posts: 2027
Joined: 6/13/2005
Status: online
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quote:
But, Obama promotes enough social programs to keep people out of poverty (because otherwise people feel hopeless) and programs that encourage and require people to take personal responsibility.
Poverty can be used by God to draw people to him. He used it often with his children when they were in rebellion against him. Sometimes we try to "prevent" God from using a means that He in scripture shows us is to our benefit and his glory and honor.
People feel hopeless when they don't have a close relationship with Christ.
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