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RE: Kicka, part 3 - 3/9/2008 5:17:43 AM
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ThursdaysChild
Posts: 322
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From: The Arabian Gulf
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Just one question...a child with Hep B is the proof that a pedophile has raped him/her or the vaccine is? It sounded a little unclear. I personally wouldn't be too upset at having my child vaccinated against Hep B. Not because I'm assuming s/he will be promiscuous, but as protection against what some evil, vile "person" could do to him/her while outside of my presence. It would be bad enough if s/he had to suffer that to begin with, but how much worse to have to suffer from a horrible disease as a result?
Otherwise, the only vaccines I approve of (preferably mandatory) are those that keep them healthy in general. Especially since we travel so much abroad. The possible side effects are extremely unlikely compared to the dangers of skipping them.
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Live your life in such a way that every morning when your feet hit the floor...Satan shudders and says..."Oh No...she's AWAKE!"
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RE: Kicka, part 3 - 3/9/2008 9:42:57 AM
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lexie
Posts: 3174
Joined: 6/27/2005
From: Toronto
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quote:
I'm not saying it *is* mandatory, I'm saying there is a push up there in Canada by lobbyists to get it made mandatory.
Of course there is a push in Canada by lobbyists to make it mandatory, same as in the US. However, the only talk of making it mandatory is by the lobbyists (and it seemed to me that your original post on the topic understood it as differently). The writer of the article thrives on fear tactics, which is what he is doing by making it seem as though it is mandatory. The government funding it is only their way of offering it in the same way they do ALL other vaccines, they are not forcing anyone to get it. We don't have to account for why we don't get it when we send our children to school.
quote:
Amen to that, and also to them pushing drugs for every little symptom .
When I was in university, I went to the doctor for some pains in my abdomen. She told me it was acid reflux and gave me a trial pack of a reflux medicine she had obviously been given by a company and would get a little money for.
I ended up going to the emergency ward and in ultrasound for 2 hours (I never took the drugs). I can't remember what it is called that I had, but I had inflamed lymph nodes around my appendix. I ended up having to stay home from school and work for three weeks and was on two sets of drugs that wiped me out completely.
Well, at least that doctor still got her money and I found a good doctor to tell me what was really wrong.
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RE: Kicka, part 3 - 3/9/2008 11:12:09 AM
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lexie
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From: Toronto
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Are there any actual mandatory vaccines at this point? Ones that you can't opt out of?
When we chose to opt out of the MMR all the doctor said was "ok, if there is an outbreak, you need to keep your daughter home from school until it's over." Other than that, there was no fuss (and we just have to fill something out when she goes to school).
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RE: Kicka, part 3 - 3/9/2008 11:25:22 AM
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Mrs.Wifey
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From: The Gorgeous plains of Colorado
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No, there aren't, Lexie. Although doctors will make you think you can't opt out.
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RE: Kicka, part 3 - 3/9/2008 11:48:08 AM
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lexie
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From: Toronto
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I do find a lot of parents think vaccinations are mandatory. A lot of parents at playgroup were surprised when they found out we opted out of the MMR. When the public health nurse came to talk about vaccinations, no one knew very much, they just got what the schedule told them to get. Our pediatrician was wonderful when I told her which ones we were not doing, but I wonder what her response would be if she didn't know me personally.
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RE: Kicka, part 3 - 3/9/2008 1:49:44 PM
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TwinCityGirl
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What about the drugs they make them take in the military? Gulf War Syndrome? There have been many, many reports of U.S. soldiers who HAD TO take medications (line up, swallow your pill, show us you swallowed it) and are now very, very sick.
I would say, from what I have heard about that, that we have had soldiers who have NOT had an option to opt out of pills or possibly vaccines -- and are now paying the price for that.
Incidentally, and I don't want to go off on this tangent because I don't want to do all the research (I don't have that kind of interest in it today), but my husband has read this Henry guy writer (can't remember his last name). He says the guy is NOT anti-Semitic, but my DH was very, very curious, Lexie, how you arrived at that. He said Henry is very well-versed on the differences between Zionists (which, as he tried to explain to me, are people who have a political agenda) and people who are devout Jews/Isrealis.
I'm not even sure I'm getting that part right, but these Zionists are not to be blindly accepted as who we should support "because God says be pro-Israel" and this Henry guy and others are labeled "anti-Semitic" because they see a problem with a group that happens to somehow, possibly flimsily be linked to being Jewish to being the people God is actually talking to us Christians about.
Again, I am not willing to go dig all this information out (I just can't commit to that and I'm sorry for being lazy) but it reminds me of Pat Buchanan, a political figure here in America. People think Pat Buchanan is a "lunatic" because he thinks we should be stricter with our borders. The guy is a "lunatic", a "bigot", a "hate-speech" guy --- none of that is true.
I hate it that people get labeled bad things because they have an honest opinion that might make sense -- that might make perfect sense for your own country! I mean, we flap open our borders for EVERYBODY and we are GOING BROKE HERE in part because of it. But if anybody mentions that, it's "hate speech". What?
So I guess I tend to not go that route quickly because SO MUCH THESE DAYS is incorrectly labeled. It's go-with-the-flow, shut up, ride the wave, do the PC thing......Not do the RIGHT thing, do the PC thing.
I don't know about that Henry guy, but I'm not willing to write him off as a lunatic just yet.
My husband is clarifying the Zionist thing for me: Zionism is a humanistic, political view, always pro-Israel no matter what. A lot of Christians think Zionists are okay because "the Bible tells us to love the Jews", but this is an AGENDA...and it's a difficult, difficult topic to understand, my husband said. It has taken him years to even understand just the little he feels he does understand.
This is not a topic I know all the stuff about (obviously!)  but in the Christian community I have read and heard multiple times that we're not to just blindly accept all that Israel said just because "we're supposed to support Israel". Well, what DOES God mean by that, and aren't there more than one group of Israelis to support? It's complicated.
Again, I can't spend my day on this but it's interesting, this rabbit trail. Heavy, but complicated. And interesting. Sorry to start up something and then declare it over-my-head-for-the-day, but I went to bed with this on my mind.
Jeanie
< Message edited by TwinCityGirl -- 3/9/2008 2:01:02 PM >
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RE: Kicka, part 3 - 3/9/2008 2:33:46 PM
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lexie
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From: Toronto
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I've read the stuff the guy has had published in the Toronto Street News. A quick read of his website has some great stuff, stuff I would agree to, but as I read further, I find stuff that is racist and sexist. I see the differences between Zionism and the Jewish people in his writing so maybe anti-semitic was too far to go, but in some articles he has tread a very slippery slope. The Toronto Street News, which publishes a lot along the same lines as he writes, has separated themselves from him because of some of the stuff he was written.
Sure he is entitled to his opinion, if other people are backing up his opinions then that is great. But the fact is, the article you cited has him stating that the hpv vaccine in Canada is going to be made mandatory by our government. He has written it that the government wants to make it mandatory, to the point where you mentioned in a post that there has been a quibble in Canada over doing such. There has been no such quibble. Allowing and funding a vaccine does not make it mandatory. I guess I get so passionate about this a) because of the things he has written and said about women and b) because he is not presenting the proper view about Canada to the rest of the world, and it annoys me if people are believing the wrong thing about our country. We're already too liberal and I don't like it, and I don't think lies and fear need to be spread to make it look worse than it is.
BTW...according to Makow, I should be preserving my racial culture and should not have married my husband. I am doing my part to make the white race disappear, I have been brainwashed by Hollywood and if I had taken a cooling off period to let my hormones settle down I wouldn't have married my husband. He's allowed to say this of course, because his second wife was Filipina. Maybe that's why I have no respect for the guy.
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RE: Kicka, part 3 - 3/9/2008 3:12:21 PM
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RepentanceIsRequired
Posts: 1087
Joined: 9/14/2005
From: Home is where the heart is.
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quote:
hate it that people get labeled bad things because they have an honest opinion that might make sense -- that might make perfect sense for your own country! I mean, we flap open our borders for EVERYBODY and we are GOING BROKE HERE in part because of it. But if anybody mentions that, it's "hate speech". What?
So I guess I tend to not go that route quickly because SO MUCH THESE DAYS is incorrectly labeled. It's go-with-the-flow, shut up, ride the wave, do the PC thing......Not do the RIGHT thing, do the PC thing.
Ryan listens to Michael Savage (and I have some) and he has spoken about this quite a bit as well. I may be in the minority with liking Savage, but I find he has a good grasp of what is going on in this country.
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--Nicole--
"Trying to be a perfect mother is a recipe for perfect insanity." -- SurpassingPeace
"I don't know what I just ate, but it was good" -- recent customer (farmer) at our restaurant.
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RE: Kicka, part 3 - 3/9/2008 6:53:07 PM
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Mrs.Wifey
Posts: 5092
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From: The Gorgeous plains of Colorado
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quote:
ORIGINAL: peculiar_lady2
Jeanie....when you are talking soldiers it's a whole other issue, because in signing up they basically sign away their right to "choose". They few soldiers that have stood up against the "mandatory" shots (anthrax esp) were kicked out or had to choose to leave the military (at least in the beginning they did). Paul chooses to not make waves, and just take whatever they say when they say (he has had all six in the anthrax series, so if he one day has a weird tick that shows up.....lol). That's one of the big differences though between a soldier and a public school student....in choosing to go to school you aren't signing away your right to choose...a soldier essentially does.
BTW...I agree with you about that whole other line of thought. Every figure that has an opinion is going to have oppotistion to that and are going to be called all manner of names by people that don't agree with their POV.
I agree, Sarah. FWIW, we aren't forcing Anthrax anymore, Micah has not had a complete series because as soon as he was told it wasn't mandatory he quit getting them.
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Ryanne
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RE: Kicka, part 3 - 3/10/2008 1:18:44 AM
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myka
Posts: 766
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Jeanie,
The soldiers who have to take the meds that the military mandates are different than children because the soldiers' bodies "belong" to the military (I know it is a bit offensive to some people) at least that is how it has been described to me. That is one of the "rights" that the US military soldiers give up. The military has a legal interest in keeping the bodies of their soldiers healthy (sometimes they don't do such a good job at it, but they have their own ideas of what they mean by healthy) and ready for combat.
The children are not "owned" by the government and are minors anyway. They are under their parent's protection and guardianship.
About the Jews and Zionists, I think that sometimes we get our political views and our religious views intermingled in such a way that we get confused about both politics and religion. I don't think it is unique to Christianity -- other religions do it also.
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RE: Kicka, part 3 - 3/10/2008 5:15:40 AM
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ThursdaysChild
Posts: 322
Joined: 1/18/2006
From: The Arabian Gulf
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OK, not to sidetrack this line of though (very interesting, btw) I found some stuff today that ties in well with a former topic.
Today I was reading an online friend's blog and found this link. From the very little I've read so far I've enjoyed these 2 items. One is the article and then the video from the post just before it. The video is a hoot!
http://www.extremetheology.com/
Before finding this, however, I was listening to Grace to You on my morning drive to school. (I love my iPod!) This is the first of a series he's doing and it tied in so well with something we've discussed here before. Then it came up again while reading the post at the link above.
http://www.oneplace.com/ministries/Grace_to_You/archives.asp?bcd=3/3/2008
Thought you ladies might enjoy checking these out. It's good food for though. Sahtayn!
_____________________________
Live your life in such a way that every morning when your feet hit the floor...Satan shudders and says..."Oh No...she's AWAKE!"
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RE: Kicka, part 3 - 3/10/2008 11:07:33 AM
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Mrs.Wifey
Posts: 5092
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From: The Gorgeous plains of Colorado
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Yea, and if you have reactions to vaccinations then obviously you won't join the military. I know Micah got every single vaccine plus some extras in bootcamp and they did them so fast, and so many together that he ended up pretty sick but his immune system was already compromised, he had mono about 6 weeks before going to boot.
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Ryanne
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RE: Kicka, part 3 - 3/10/2008 4:47:18 PM
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bride48
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From: Near Boston
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Interesting article, Thursdays. And yes, it fits into MacArthur's current series.
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Joyfully,
DebbieLynne
The General and the Poet (blog entry)
<--Taken on August 24, 2008: our 6th anniversary
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RE: Kicka, part 3 - 3/10/2008 5:40:47 PM
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TwinCityGirl
Posts: 965
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Does the paperwork they sign when they enlist or reenlist specifically say that they are giving their bodies over like that, medicinally or experimentally medicinally? I only ask just because I am really curious as to whether it's just a KNOWN THING (but not formal) or if it's actually CONTRACTUAL.
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RE: Kicka, part 3 - 3/10/2008 6:41:56 PM
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Mrs.Wifey
Posts: 5092
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From: The Gorgeous plains of Colorado
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quote:
ORIGINAL: TwinCityGirl
Does the paperwork they sign when they enlist or reenlist specifically say that they are giving their bodies over like that, medicinally or experimentally medicinally? I only ask just because I am really curious as to whether it's just a KNOWN THING (but not formal) or if it's actually CONTRACTUAL.
quote:
9. For all Enlistees or reenlistees: Many laws, regulations, and military customs will govern my conduct and require me to do things a civilian does not have to do. The following statements are not promises or guarantees of any kind. They explain some of the present laws affecting the Armed Forces which I cannot change but which congress can change at any time.
It does not specifically state the medical things, but when you go through MEPS, if you have been honest about your problems then you will get weeded out or made aware of what is going to happen to you.
The contract goes on to state that "this is more then an employment agreement"....
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Ryanne
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RE: Kicka, part 3 - 3/10/2008 6:57:25 PM
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TwinCityGirl
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Ryanne and Sarah:
Thanks for the answers. I don't want Paul to go to extra work if he's not just curious himself....I can take your word for it.
What is MEPS? Is that a medical evaluation before/as you enlist?
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RE: Kicka, part 3 - 3/10/2008 8:13:57 PM
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Mrs.Wifey
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Sarah, I pulled that straight out of the enlistment contract so I wouldn't have Paul bother, lol.
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Ryanne
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RE: Kicka, part 3 - 3/11/2008 11:17:23 PM
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Mrs.Wifey
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From: The Gorgeous plains of Colorado
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Darn, Jeanie. You posted I was hoping your absence today was because you were off having a wee one.
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Ryanne
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