|
Users viewing this topic:
none
|
|
Login  | |
|
RE: Black liberation theology - 5/19/2008 9:02:00 AM
|
|
|
P31W
Posts: 2441
Joined: 6/13/2005
Status: offline
|
quote:
I think BO is one of our last chances.
For whom? Unborn babies. To have a knife stuck in the back of a babies head? (BTW BO's church - BLT - supports abortion as well - I guess they are so stuck on themselves they don't even know the blood of those millions of babies are crying out to God and the blood is on THIER hands for supporting it with their votes and lack of action to stop it.)
As far as "this thread" is concerned BO with HIS black liberation theology has done nothing but "hurt" race relations. He writes very plainly in one of his books that he hold to BLT. His actions "prove" that he believes in that theology. His wife's actions and words support the fact that they believe in BLT> He made his mentor a BLT preacher for 20 years and worked to actively bring that man into his family and put him on various committies ----- what more evidence can we have?
You believe that voting for a pro-abortion, pro-gay marriage, most liberal senator in washington, who holds to BLT is a step in the 'right direction" or our "last chance". Sure Tracy whatever "you say". 
BTW the Sadducees were the religious liberals in scripture.
< Message edited by P31W -- 5/19/2008 9:29:04 AM >
|
|
|
|
|
RE: Black liberation theology - 5/19/2008 9:29:13 AM
|
|
|
tracydolls
Posts: 1815
Joined: 3/30/2008
Status: offline
|
quote:
Many people don't realize that Dr. King had an in-house debate with the violent activists of his day. Some advocated violence as a part of the civil rights struggle. Dr. King actually opposed that. Many in the white community don't realize they had that debate.
That is so true, Martin argued with Malcolm x and after MLK died, it became "Black Power" and became violent. BLT came about at this time with James Cones Book. Which is what this Church is based on.
I've try to talk to people about it. Most black people I know , know that Rev. Wright is not right.
They know it is not the Gospel of Jesus Christ.
MLK had the right thoughts, only Love can change any of this.
_____________________________
Rev 3:17 Because thou sayest, I am rich, and increased with goods, and have need of nothing; and knowest not that thou art wretched, and miserable, and poor, and blind, and naked:
|
|
|
|
|
RE: Black liberation theology - 5/19/2008 9:40:13 AM
|
|
|
tracydolls
Posts: 1815
Joined: 3/30/2008
Status: offline
|
quote:
You believe that voting for a pro-abortion, pro-gay marriage, most liberal senator in washington, who holds to BLT is a step in the 'right direction" or our "last chance". Sure Tracy whatever "you say".
No wrong, I have said time and time again that I do not support BO or BLT! For the last several weeks I have been trying to tell my family, friends, don't buy into that junk. It is a bunch of junk that will only bring violence. And black people are not gonna win. We cannot make every white person pay for anything.
I think BO is one of our last chances to get rid of racism!
As you can see daily on TV, this country is full of racists. The Dems showed theirs!
No matter what you feel about BO, we cannot get into Heaven with Racism in our hearts.
I personally don't think the man is quailified. How? Where's the experience to run the US.
I'm still shocked he made it this far. I think most people are.
_____________________________
Rev 3:17 Because thou sayest, I am rich, and increased with goods, and have need of nothing; and knowest not that thou art wretched, and miserable, and poor, and blind, and naked:
|
|
|
|
|
RE: Black liberation theology - 5/19/2008 10:05:18 AM
|
|
|
P31W
Posts: 2441
Joined: 6/13/2005
Status: offline
|
quote:
we cannot get into Heaven with Racism in our hearts.
This is false.
For God so loved the world that he gave his only begotten Son so what whosoever believed in him shall not perish but have everlasting life.
We are saved by faith not by works lest any man should boast.
|
|
|
|
|
RE: Black liberation theology - 5/19/2008 11:37:56 AM
|
|
|
MrFribbles
Posts: 1240
Joined: 1/29/2007
From: Hawaii, but I've moved around since then
Status: offline
|
quote:
quote:
we cannot get into Heaven with Racism in our hearts.
This is false.
Well, to an extent it is. In heaven, there will certainly be no racists. So, to actually enter into Heaven itself, we must have no racism - but that will be no work of our own, it will be Christ's righteousness working for our sake, by grace through faith, like you said.
But just as it is possible for a Christian to tell lies, or steal, or hate someone for their sexual preference, it is sadly possible for someone to be a Christian and be racist. It's not how things should be, and they will be under conviction from the Holy Spirit if they really are saved, but it will be a struggle for them - just like it is for all of us with sin.
_____________________________
You're a door without a key,
A field without a fence.
You've made a holy fool of me,
And I've thanked you ever since.
- Aaron Weiss
|
|
|
|
|
RE: Black liberation theology - 5/19/2008 11:55:44 AM
|
|
|
tracydolls
Posts: 1815
Joined: 3/30/2008
Status: offline
|
quote:
we cannot get into Heaven with Racism in our hearts.
This is false.
 What ? Are you for real?
So I can go back to being a violent racist, telling my brothers and sisters to keep buying weapons, defend yourself from racists. Beat up every white person that looks cross-eyed at you. Beat them up if they come into our neighborhood. Especially the white girls that date black men.
Keep saying "blue-eyed devils" saying ALL white people are .........
I can tell people that Rev. Wright is right?
Hate my mother and grandchildren, and I will still get into Heaven?
ok.
< Message edited by tracydolls -- 5/19/2008 2:22:55 PM >
_____________________________
Rev 3:17 Because thou sayest, I am rich, and increased with goods, and have need of nothing; and knowest not that thou art wretched, and miserable, and poor, and blind, and naked:
|
|
|
|
|
RE: Black liberation theology - 5/19/2008 6:47:56 PM
|
|
|
bob97
Posts: 1790
Joined: 6/24/2006
From: Kansas
Status: offline
|
If you are a true child of God you will not be a racist. You might have unhealed intolerance in you heart but you will have a growing understanding for all men. As we grow we will find ourselves with more and more tendencies to look beyond the prejudice. This does not mean that we unilaterally agree with the other position but we make uncommon effort to adjust.
Bob
_____________________________
The LORD clears the road for me!
The LORD is my high ridge, my stronghold, my deliverer!
|
|
|
|
|
RE: Black liberation theology - 5/20/2008 10:42:37 AM
|
|
|
P31W
Posts: 2441
Joined: 6/13/2005
Status: offline
|
Tracy,
What you have described is hate.
The American Heritage Dictionary defines racism as follows:
1. Discrimination or prejudice based on race
2. The belief that race accounts for differences in human character or ability and that a particular race is superior to others
quote:
we cannot get into Heaven with Racism in our hearts.
This is false. (p31w)
What ? Are you for real?
We need to discuss this based on two facts. This is the Doctrine folder and secondly it appears by some of the questions you have asked me (what is the chruch) and the background from which you say you come lead me to believe doctrine does need to be discussed.
I guess to be more accurate there will be "no" sin in heaven as another poster said. However there are three terms here we need to look at.
Justification
Sanctification
Glorification
Justification occurs the instant we repent of our sin and turn to Christ asking him to be our Lord and Savior. At that very instant we are saved. We have eternal life. If we die that very next second we are going to go to heaven. (we are saved by faith not by being "sinless" or "perfect" or "works")
Sanctification - this is the process by which we become Christlike. As we begin to grow in Christ we begin to sin less and less, we begin to become more aware of our sins ..... this is a spiritural growth process...... for most of us we never attain "perfection or a sinless state of being" even so.... if we die we will go to heaven.
Glorification - this is when Christ makes us "perfect" and "without sin" and we are able to enter into heaven.
If the only people who were allowed into heaven were "perfect sinless" people while here on earth than none of us would probably get there. Especially me.
If you want to say that racist people will not get into heaven you need to also say "people who have not truly forgiven others from their hearts and harbor anger" won't either. 
< Message edited by P31W -- 5/20/2008 11:24:39 AM >
|
|
|
|
|
RE: Black liberation theology - 5/20/2008 9:42:17 PM
|
|
|
tracydolls
Posts: 1815
Joined: 3/30/2008
Status: offline
|
quote:
If a person is a racist by your definitiion; then they probably are not Christian, since you equate racism with violence, hate, etc.
But folks that act that way are criminals as well as recist.
Racism does not necessarily mean hate.
Maybe that's the junk you tell yourself. LOL ok
_____________________________
Rev 3:17 Because thou sayest, I am rich, and increased with goods, and have need of nothing; and knowest not that thou art wretched, and miserable, and poor, and blind, and naked:
|
|
|
|
|
RE: Black liberation theology - 5/20/2008 9:50:15 PM
|
|
|
tracydolls
Posts: 1815
Joined: 3/30/2008
Status: offline
|
quote:
2. The belief that race accounts for differences in human character or ability and that a particular race is superior to others
So when I tell Black people that they are superior to white folks, that is not racist.
When I tell them we WERE the first people! Rome found Europeans in caves, no written language, wild men. Is that racist?
quote:
by some of the questions you have asked me (what is the chruch) and the background from which you say you come lead me to believe doctrine does need to be discussed.
Your kidding right? Believe me PW I don't want to discuss your chruch with you. From your posts I'm pretty sure I would not be welcome at your chruch. I merely posted this asking what you think Church is? In response to one of your posts.
I know what Jesus said is HIS CHURCH, I follow that.
thanks anyways.
I know that you cannot be a unrepentive racist and think you are getting away.
I also know not everyone is going to Heaven.
If you want to believe it go ahead.
I guess I can start telling people that Rev. Wright is ok... Listen to him.
< Message edited by tracydolls -- 5/20/2008 9:57:16 PM >
_____________________________
Rev 3:17 Because thou sayest, I am rich, and increased with goods, and have need of nothing; and knowest not that thou art wretched, and miserable, and poor, and blind, and naked:
|
|
|
|
|
RE: Black liberation theology - 5/20/2008 10:14:33 PM
|
|
|
GrahamCracker
Posts: 1960
Joined: 4/11/2005
From: Dallas, TX
Status: offline
|
From Tracydolls:
quote:
So when I tell Black people that they are superior to white folks, that is not racist.
The question of racial differences accounting for a higher level of civilization among mankind, that would indeed be racist.
quote:
When I tell them we WERE the first people! Rome found Europeans in caves, no written language, wild men. Is that racist?
Hmmm. Romans were Europeans too. If anyone suggests that Romans were black versus northern Europeans being white, I don't think that is factually correct. However, if your statements were factually correct, I don't think it would in itself be racist.
Anyway, northern/and/or western Europeans, I believe DID have written language. But, their "civilization" was almost certainly not as advanced as those of the Mediterranean Basin and Middle East of the same period.
On the question as to whether or not racists could make it into heaven. Let me attempt to interpret. Many different theological views are being represented here. PW31, I think, is not trying to excuse discrimination---and rejection of blacks from white churches or whites from black churches. I believe what she is saying---is that with all of our wicked, evil sinfulness--she would say that all men, white or black are accepted into the kingdom of God based on our faith in Christ---not ultimately our behavior.
One of the dilemmas in some churches, is what to do when someone who has professed true faith in Christ--is discovered to be blatantly disobedient to Christ. The question would be--Is that person saved or unsaved? Or, did that person lose their salvation or were they ever saved to begin with?
Tracy,
It is an in house debate among people, for example, Evangelical Baptist persuasion. (and other semi-Calvinistic groups) It does not mean they excuse racism, but that they cannot sufficiently understand the tension between forgiveness and grace.
_____________________________
Larry
Sure we're under the law, everybody knows that!
When He said, "A new covenant," He has made the first obsolete. But whatever is becoming obsolete and growing old is ready to disappear. (Heb 10:13)
|
|
|
|
|
RE: Black liberation theology - 5/20/2008 11:06:36 PM
|
|
|
bob97
Posts: 1790
Joined: 6/24/2006
From: Kansas
Status: offline
|
quote:
When I tell them we WERE the first people! Rome found Europeans in caves, no written language, wild men. Is that racist?
Tracy, is this a factual statement and if so what are you saying… that Adam and Eve were black skinned? I'm a little confused here, like always.
Bob
_____________________________
The LORD clears the road for me!
The LORD is my high ridge, my stronghold, my deliverer!
|
|
|
|
|
RE: Black liberation theology - 5/21/2008 12:15:22 AM
|
|
|
tracydolls
Posts: 1815
Joined: 3/30/2008
Status: offline
|
quote:
Hmmm. Romans were Europeans too. If anyone suggests that Romans were black versus northern Europeans being white, I don't think that is factually correct. However, if your statements were factually correct, I don't think it would in itself be racist
Well I don't think Romans were anything but Romans, we know they conquered European so they didnt look European until they mixed.
There were 3 African Popes, so I would assume that their were AFrican people in Rome. people of African persuasion there.
http://www.africawithin.com/religion/african_popes.htm
There were three African Popes who came from the region of North Africa. Although there are no authentic portraits of these popes, there are drawings and references in the Catholic Encyclopedia as to their being of African background. The names of the Three African Popes are: Victor (183-203 A.D.), Gelasius (492-496 A.D.), and Mechiades or Militiades (311-314 A.D.). All are saints.
quote:
I believe what she is saying---is that with all of our wicked, evil sinfulness--she would say that all men, white or black are accepted into the kingdom of God based on our faith in Christ---not ultimately our behavior.
I believe it is G-d's Grace, and our faith. I beg to differ on behavior:
Mat 25:40 And the King shall answer and say unto them, Verily I say unto you, Inasmuch as ye have done it unto one of the least of these my brethren, ye have done it unto me.
Mat 25:41 Then shall he say also unto them on the left hand, Depart from me, ye cursed, into everlasting fire, prepared for the devil and his angels:
Mat 25:42 For I was an hungred, and ye gave me no meat: I was thirsty, and ye gave me no drink:
Mat 25:43 I was a stranger, and ye took me not in: naked, and ye clothed me not: sick, and in prison, and ye visited me not.
Mat 25:44 Then shall they also answer him, saying, Lord, when saw we thee an hungred, or athirst, or a stranger, or naked, or sick, or in prison, and did not minister unto thee?
I think we can see that there are things you can do and not do to be put in Hell.
quote:
Tracy, is this a factual statement and if so what are you saying… that Adam and Eve were black skinned? I'm a little confused here, like always.
Tell me what you see from the DNA of the first people. When you look at Sudan or Tanzania, what are those people? They are unchanged in color for 1000's of years.
http://www.bradshawfoundation.com/stephenoppenheimer/stephen-oppenheimer.html
Yes, I believe Adam & Eve were black just like those people are today.
I don't think racism is ok, how do you love your neighbor?
If's it;s ok, what's the big deal about Rev. Wright?
< Message edited by tracydolls -- 5/21/2008 12:24:03 AM >
_____________________________
Rev 3:17 Because thou sayest, I am rich, and increased with goods, and have need of nothing; and knowest not that thou art wretched, and miserable, and poor, and blind, and naked:
|
|
|
|
|
RE: Black liberation theology - 5/21/2008 12:26:01 AM
|
|
|
MrFribbles
Posts: 1240
Joined: 1/29/2007
From: Hawaii, but I've moved around since then
Status: offline
|
quote:
I think we can see that there are things you can do and not do to be put in Hell.
Careful, tracy. You're treading on delicate ground here. Everyone sins, and I believe that, in terms of judgment, God views all sins equally. If someone is racist, but repentantly so, I firmly believe they will enter heaven, just as I believe a repentant murderer, adulterer, etc., will enter heaven. Would you agree?
_____________________________
You're a door without a key,
A field without a fence.
You've made a holy fool of me,
And I've thanked you ever since.
- Aaron Weiss
|
|
|
|
|
RE: Black liberation theology - 5/21/2008 12:53:10 AM
|
|
|
bob97
Posts: 1790
Joined: 6/24/2006
From: Kansas
Status: offline
|
Tracy,
So you discount the Biblical that view that the sons of Noah dispersed and that various nations and people descended from Japheth, Shem and Ham. That these three sons correspond to the three races: Europeans, Semites, and Africans?
I assume then in your view if Adam was black then so was Noah?
If you assume that Adam and Eve were black skinned then is quite possible that Christ who walked with them in the garden was also blacked skinned.
Bob
_____________________________
The LORD clears the road for me!
The LORD is my high ridge, my stronghold, my deliverer!
|
|
|
|
|
RE: Black liberation theology - 5/21/2008 1:02:44 AM
|
|
|
MrFribbles
Posts: 1240
Joined: 1/29/2007
From: Hawaii, but I've moved around since then
Status: offline
|
quote:
I assume then in your view if Adam was black then so was Noah?
If you assume that Adam and Eve were black skinned then is quite possible that Christ who walked with them in the garden was also blacked skinned.
Just throwing in my two cents...
I find no reason to make racial assumptions about Bible characters. I believe earth's atmosphere (and thus, the sun's UV rays and other factors that affect skin color) was vastly different before the flood, so I see no reason to think that the pre-flood humanity had any skin color we can predict. During post-flood Bible history, I would guess that the Jewish people looked very much like people from the Middle East look like today. Not white, but also not black - they would have, most likely, looked Middle Eastern.
However, it ultimately doesn't matter. Christ didn't care about His skin color, or the skin color of the people He died for. Why should we?
_____________________________
You're a door without a key,
A field without a fence.
You've made a holy fool of me,
And I've thanked you ever since.
- Aaron Weiss
|
|
|
|
|
RE: Black liberation theology - 5/21/2008 7:10:40 AM
|
|
|
GrahamCracker
Posts: 1960
Joined: 4/11/2005
From: Dallas, TX
Status: offline
|
quote:
Well I don't think Romans were anything but Romans, we know they conquered European so they didn't look European until they mixed.
There were 3 African Popes, so I would assume that their were African people in Rome. people of African persuasion there.
I don't think there's any debate that many of the Popes, including the present one were not Italian (he's actually German).
Since Italy is part of Europe, I don't understand how you can say "they didn't look European." It would be like saying you or I don't look American. Besides, European is not an ethnic group. Europe is a continent. There are olive skinned Europeans as well as pasty white, blond, blue-eyed Europeans.
As to how they looked, we do have some idea how Romans looked. Haven't you ever seen any busts of any of the emporers?
See here. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Julius_Caesar
quote:
There were three African Popes who came from the region of North Africa. Although there are no authentic portraits of these popes, there are drawings and references in the Catholic Encyclopedia as to their being of African background. The names of the Three African Popes are: Victor (183-203 A.D.), Gelasius (492-496 A.D.), and Mechiades or Militiades (311-314 A.D.). All are saints.
Ok. Look, I am not trying to detract from black's contributions to western civilization. I honestly had no idea there were three African popes.
In any event, Augustine of Hippo (not actually a pope but a theologian) was from Africa. Hippo was in Africa, I believe. I don't know if that actually made him black or not, but for the sake of conversation, I'll concede the point to your side.
quote:
I think we can see that there are things you can do and not do to be put in Hell.
You missed my point entirely. The text doesn't say that those people were Christians who ultimately were so bad that God threw them into hell. As I said, the issue is often debated as to whether or not someone who has professed faith in Christ could actually live habitually and do the things mentioned. I am not trying to resolve the entire issue here. That's what we have other threads for. Some of them are going on right now.
quote:
quote:
Tracy, is this a factual statement and if so what are you saying… that Adam and Eve were black skinned? I'm a little confused here, like always.
Tell me what you see from the DNA of the first people. When you look at Sudan or Tanzania, what are those people? They are unchanged in color for 1000's of years.
My two cents. I believe that Adam and Eve contained the DNA of all races, black and white. I believe it was the further dispersion and isolation that resulted in the races. One could no more say that Adam and Eve were black any more than one could say that they were white. Considering that black genes tend to be dominate, it is more likely that they were NOT blue-eyed and blond.
_____________________________
Larry
Sure we're under the law, everybody knows that!
When He said, "A new covenant," He has made the first obsolete. But whatever is becoming obsolete and growing old is ready to disappear. (Heb 10:13)
|
|
|
|
|
RE: Black liberation theology - 5/21/2008 8:43:39 AM
|
|
|
P31W
Posts: 2441
Joined: 6/13/2005
Status: offline
|
quote:
On the question as to whether or not racists could make it into heaven. Let me attempt to interpret. Many different theological views are being represented here. PW31, I think, is not trying to excuse discrimination---and rejection of blacks from white churches or whites from black churches. I believe what she is saying---is that with all of our wicked, evil sinfulness--she would say that all men, white or black are accepted into the kingdom of God based on our faith in Christ---not ultimately our behavior.
Yes!!! It's all about our faith in Jesus Christ and the work He did on the Cross. All our good works are nothing more than filthy rage before the Lord.
We are saved by faith not by works lest ANY man should boast.
Our good works or lack there of are "evidences" of whether or not we are truly saved. (as James tells us faith without works is dead and good for nothing)
(people who believe that we must have works and faith often also believe that if we die commiting a sin then we are doomed to hell and people who take thier own life are going to hell as well)
When we accept Christ as our Lord and Savior he forgives us of "all" our sins....past, present and future. God sees me through the shed blood of Christ.
< Message edited by P31W -- 5/21/2008 8:52:00 AM >
|
|
|
|
|
RE: Black liberation theology - 5/21/2008 10:09:41 AM
|
|
|
tracydolls
Posts: 1815
Joined: 3/30/2008
Status: offline
|
quote:
That these three sons correspond to the three races: Europeans, Semites, and Africans?
Ok where in the Bible does it say they were Europeans, Semites, and Africans?
None of those words are in the Bible. Ethiopian is, Egyptian is.
Yes, I believe most all Bible people were black, all the way down to Jesus and beyond.
Jesus hid in Egypt an African state,with Black people. You cannot hide there now if you are Blond, etc. I'm pretty sure 2000 years ago before Arabs or Eurpeans came, it was even darker.
It says things like your lands will be famined, etc. Who's lands are famined?
quote:
Since Italy is part of Europe, I don't understand how you can say "they didn't look European." It would be like saying you or I don't look American. Besides, European is not an ethnic group. Europe is a continent. There are olive skinned Europeans as well as pasty white, blond, blue-eyed Europeans.
Rome CONQUERED Europe. Europeans love to claim Roman history,
that would be like Native claiming European history.
go read what the first Romans wrote about the albinions they encountered.
quote:
I would guess that the Jewish people looked very much like people from the Middle East look like today. Not white, but also not black - they would have, most likely, looked Middle Eastern.
since a South aFrican tribe tested more Jewish than alot of the pop. of Israel today, I would guess there are Black Jews.
You do realize that Mohammed didnt conquer the middle east until 600 AD.
So that "middle eastern" look didnt come until then.
I do know that a unrepentive racist is in trouble. I cannot say who is saved or not. Only Jesus knows, and He did lay out some rules to go by.
Love G-D, and your neighbor.
How are you doing that if you are a racist?
_____________________________
Rev 3:17 Because thou sayest, I am rich, and increased with goods, and have need of nothing; and knowest not that thou art wretched, and miserable, and poor, and blind, and naked:
|
|
|
|
|
RE: Black liberation theology - 5/21/2008 10:20:01 AM
|
|
|
P31W
Posts: 2441
Joined: 6/13/2005
Status: offline
|
Tracey,
This is a thread about "doctrine" and more important "Black Liberation Theology".
If you cannot discuss the "theology" of that group please leave the thread.
(BTW you do now that BLT teaches a literal Black Jesus but that topic does not help us better understand their core doctrines only adds a little to our understanding or mindset)
If you want to discuss the "Black Jesus" please start another thread.
< Message edited by P31W -- 5/21/2008 10:27:53 AM >
|
|
|
|
|
RE: Black liberation theology - 5/21/2008 4:50:54 PM
|
|
|
tracydolls
Posts: 1815
Joined: 3/30/2008
Status: offline
|
quote:
Tracey,
This is a thread about "doctrine" and more important "Black Liberation Theology".
If you cannot discuss the "theology" of that group please leave the thread.
(BTW you do now that BLT teaches a literal Black Jesus but that topic does not help us better understand their core doctrines only adds a little to our understanding or mindset)
If you want to discuss the "Black Jesus" please start another thread.
I always find that funny, when people chose one side to tsk tsk.
Very telling.
I say this if racism is ok, then Rev. Wright is right .
BLT is a good thing, we should spread it and teach it, because racism is ok.
_____________________________
Rev 3:17 Because thou sayest, I am rich, and increased with goods, and have need of nothing; and knowest not that thou art wretched, and miserable, and poor, and blind, and naked:
|
|
|
|
|
RE: Black liberation theology - 5/21/2008 6:09:30 PM
|
|
|
GrahamCracker
Posts: 1960
Joined: 4/11/2005
From: Dallas, TX
Status: offline
|
quote:
Yes, I believe most all Bible people were black, all the way down to Jesus and beyond.
That claim is entirely without merit. If Jews of the OT were black, then Ethiopians would have had no distinctive skin color different from Israelites.
"Can the Ethiopian change his skin, or the leopard his spots? [then] may ye also do good, that are accustomed to do evil." (Jer 13:23, KJV)
quote:
Jesus hid in Egypt an African state,with Black people. You cannot hide there now if you are Blond, etc. I'm pretty sure 2000 years ago before Arabs or Eurpeans came, it was even darker.
Jesus' running from Herod put Jesus out of Herod's jurisdiction. People of other nationalities crossed boundaries all of the time. Jesus would not have been the only Jew in Egypt. And certainly, I don't believe for a moment that Jesus was blond.
More likely, He had olive skin and black hair, like Middle Easterners today. Jesus was of Semitic origin, like all Jews. Descendants of Ham (of the three sons of Noah, if you believe the Bible) were probably black. Jesus did not descend from Ham, except possibly some incidental areas of His genes. In that case, I could possibly have some black blood in me and I would not even know.
quote:
Rome CONQUERED Europe. Europeans love to claim Roman history,
So? Rome is in Italy. Italy is in Europe.
quote:
that would be like Native claiming European history.
go read what the first Romans wrote about the albinions they encountered.
Please don't suggest that I do research to prove some convoluted point you may be making. If you have solid data and a point, please present it, with the evidence thereof.
Roman history is a part of European history. Rome conquered much of southern Europe, northern Africa and the Middle East. Rome and Italy are in Europe. The ancient history of Europe would be incomplete without a mention of the Roman Empire.
The original Romans were probably closer to Caucasians than any other ethnic group. IOW, white. Obviously, mixtures of other races are probably there. The Romans of the famous Roman Empire were certainly not black. There were probably black citizens of the Roman Empire, possibly even officials. St. Paul, in the Bible, was a Roman citizen. But he was a Jew.
quote:
You do realize that Mohammed didnt conquer the middle east until 600 AD.
So that "middle eastern" look didnt come until then.
So what was it before then? It certainly wasn't black "...it seems to indicate that a significant proportion of these peoples' ancestry comes from a common Near Eastern population to which (despite the differences with the Biblical genealogy) the term "Semitic" has been applied. However, this correlation should rather be attributed to said common Near Eastern origin, as for example Semitic-speaking Near Easterners from the Fertile Crescent are generally more closely related to non-Semitic speaking Near Easterners, such as Iranians, Anatolians, and Caucasians, than to other Semitic-speakers, such as Gulf Arabs, Eritrean Semites, Ethiopian Semites, and North African Arabs...."
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Semitic
_____________________________
Larry
Sure we're under the law, everybody knows that!
When He said, "A new covenant," He has made the first obsolete. But whatever is becoming obsolete and growing old is ready to disappear. (Heb 10:13)
|
|
|
|
|
RE: Black liberation theology - 5/21/2008 6:10:50 PM
|
|
|
GrahamCracker
Posts: 1960
Joined: 4/11/2005
From: Dallas, TX
Status: offline
|
PW31
So that we might not get too far afield and deviate from the presumed topic. What are the boundaries of this topic? BLT proponents probably do make some of the claims that Tracy is making.
_____________________________
Larry
Sure we're under the law, everybody knows that!
When He said, "A new covenant," He has made the first obsolete. But whatever is becoming obsolete and growing old is ready to disappear. (Heb 10:13)
|
|
| | |
Forum Tools
Printable Version
