RE: A Christian WILL NOT Continuously Sin! (Full Version)

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hawkfan428 -> RE: A Christian WILL NOT Continuously Sin! (3/31/2008 12:49:52 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: earthless

I guess the Apostle Paul was not a child of God.

I sin every single day. I don't want to, but I do and will continue to do so until God gives me my glorified body. This flesh is tainted and we live in a sinful/fallen world.

RC - I know all of the "Holiness" counterpoints so please don't bother. But this is really odd when people claim they are perfect and sinless here and now, that they actually do believe and express to others that they no longer sin.

I had a man like this once at my old church.. during testimony time he went up and started sharing how we were wrong in not adhering to Holiness theology... he went on and on about being perfect and having reached a point in his walk with the Lord where he no longer sinned.

His wife interrupted him and said, "Albert... you know I live with you... and your kids sitting here can also tell these people here differently."

He was stone silent. Never said another word and they never returned.



Well put! Any Christian who thinks they are without sin is fooling themself. Jesus is our Advocate/Counselor. His blood cleanses us from our sin. That doesn't mean that we are "sinless", we are just cleansed from it and forgiven for it by Jesus.



earthless -> RE: A Christian WILL NOT Continuously Sin! (3/31/2008 12:52:55 PM)

Stamped and sealed by the Holy Spirit for the day of Redemption. [:)]



rcjames -> RE: A Christian WILL NOT Continuously Sin! (3/31/2008 1:14:14 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: earthless
RC - I know all of the "Holiness" counterpoints so please don't bother. But this is really odd when people claim they are perfect and sinless here and now, that they actually do believe and express to others that they no longer sin.


Maybe you are just reading too fast, the OP was about, and my asnswe was about "Continuosly sinning" (continue in sin, walk in sin) not about being perfect

I would ask you to please post where in Scripture that continuing is sin is okey dokey with the Father. I do not seem to be able to find it.

quote:

Stamped and sealed by the Holy Spirit for the day of Redemption.[:)]


That what the folks in Matthew 7 thought, but found out otherwise.

They said "Lord, Lord", and he answered, "Depart from Me."

Thanks
RC



jfaye -> RE: A Christian WILL NOT Continuously Sin! (3/31/2008 1:18:33 PM)

We will not be 'comfortable' or at peace with the Lord if we continue to sin/transgress in any
area of habitually defaulting to the old nature! We will find His voice is less and less discernable
because we have a 'wall' of unconfessed sinfulness we are not willing to keep coming to Him to
help us overcome!

1 John 1: 6 "If we say that we have fellowship with Him and yet walk in the darkness, we lie and
do not practice the truth;

7 but if we walk in the Light as He Himself is in the Light, we have fellowship with one another,
and the blood of Jesus His Son cleanses us from all sin.

8 If we say that we have no sin, we are deceiving ourselves and the truth is not in us.

9 f we confess our sins, He is faithful and righteous to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from
all unrighteousness.

10 If we say that we have not sinned, we make Him a liar and His word is not in us."

In confessed sin, we are agreeing with God that it is unacceptable to continue in it and we seek
His enabling to no longer walk in it! That can be a daily, moment by moment thing for most of us,
especially in the 'baby-steps' of our faith walk, and after taking a 'hiatus' from being closely in
touch with Him, through prayer and being in the Word!

It seems a very slippery slope down from a God-dependent walk of success with Him, and we can
slide back into the old ways so easily and it seems hard work to climb back up to the level of
a more successful and apparent close walk with Him. Kinda makes it not worth the distraction that
interferes with that 'good work' being done in us, in staying close by His side! [8|]



butterfly123 -> RE: A Christian WILL NOT Continuously Sin! (3/31/2008 1:21:37 PM)

At our worse Christians can try to sin all they can, but know they should not, and are doing it as fast as possible before they are "caught". Being "caught" by the Holy Spirit never is fun and should lead to repentance and the path of santification.



earthless -> RE: A Christian WILL NOT Continuously Sin! (3/31/2008 2:06:13 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: rcjames

quote:

ORIGINAL: earthless
RC - I know all of the "Holiness" counterpoints so please don't bother. But this is really odd when people claim they are perfect and sinless here and now, that they actually do believe and express to others that they no longer sin.


Maybe you are just reading too fast, the OP was about, and my asnswe was about "Continuosly sinning" (continue in sin, walk in sin) not about being perfect

I would ask you to please post where in Scripture that continuing is sin is okey dokey with the Father. I do not seem to be able to find it.

quote:

Stamped and sealed by the Holy Spirit for the day of Redemption.[:)]


That what the folks in Matthew 7 thought, but found out otherwise.

They said "Lord, Lord", and he answered, "Depart from Me."

Thanks
RC


RC,

I know I am saved because of Jesus. My salvation is not something I am certain of because I think I am sinless.

As for continuing in sin? That is not what I and others mean. But to say we can reach a point in this earthly life where we no longer sin at all, is absurd and insulting to what God's grace is and what sin (omission and commission) actually is.



ta_mosquito -> RE: A Christian WILL NOT Continuously Sin! (3/31/2008 3:14:15 PM)

MODERATOR'S NOTE :: ATTENTION PLEASE

We've got enough threads running about whether a Christian can/should be sinless.

Please keep this on the topic of the OP - that is, whether a Christian can be in continuous, willful disobedience.

Thanks!

Tricia
Forums Moderator

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jbow -> RE: A Christian WILL NOT Continuously Sin! (3/31/2008 3:42:00 PM)

quote:

His wife interrupted him and said, "Albert... you know I live with you... and your kids sitting here can also tell these people here differently."


[:o]

J



jfaye -> RE: A Christian WILL NOT Continuously Sin! (3/31/2008 3:52:09 PM)

quote:

Now, do you agree with the following statement? Why or why not.

A Christian WILL NOT Continuously Sin.


Okay--Yes, I agree with the statement!

If a person, professing salvation is able to live on in a life of habitual sinning, nothing changing, no
remorse over remaining in such a lifestyle, I believe that is evidence of a lack of the fruit of repentance
we know is a direct response to the Holy Spirit residing in our hearts!

A profession of the mouth that does not translate to a changed heart, finding habitual and enslaving sin,
a thing to be hated, with a desire to be freed from, is a false testimony of a heart turned toward God!

We will commit sin, but it will not be something we run to do, with no remorse or regret in having failed
to walk in newness of life!

I.E.--we will not stay in an immoral relationship, one that constitutes sexual activity outside of marriage
nor will we stay in any sexual activity that is spelled out as abhorrent to the Lord, as a continued
lifestyle by which we are identified by.

We will not stay enslaved to a habit that causes our bodies harm, without looking to be freed from it!

We will not continually lie as a means to deal with difficulty in our lives or as a means to exalt 'self'!

We will not continue to use trashy language, as a continuing habit throughout the years of our walk
with the Lord, and be comfortable doing it, giving no thought to the wrongness of it!

We will not be a thief by profession or as a way to obtain what we want when we have no other means to obtain it!

We will not indulge in pornography with no shame and with no intention and no desire to be freed from it!

We are 'new' creations, by virtue of the residing Holy Spirit in place! We are new to guilt and the desire
to live as He wants us to and we will want to be all He wants us to be, though it will be a stumbling attempt
as 'babes in Christ' until we learn to walk closely with Him, dependent on Him for the very strength to walk
through this dirty, dusty world we live in!

We will need 'foot washing' daily for a long while and even so, there will be 'times' of defaulting, but it will not be
to be in a lifestyle that we are identified by, such as 'liar', 'adulterer', 'murderer', 'addict' or 'thief'!

2 Corinthians 5: 17 "Therefore if anyone is in Christ, he is a new creature; the old things passed away;
behold, new things have come."

"Proof's in the pudding!"[8|]



jfaye -> RE: A Christian WILL NOT Continuously Sin! (3/31/2008 4:10:13 PM)

quote:

quote:

His wife interrupted him and said, "Albert... you know I live with you... and your kids sitting here can also tell these people here differently."


How does a person live with themselves, and look full in the face of the ones who really know the truth about them,
and make such claims?[sm=icon_smile_yikes.gif] To me, that is the height of self-delusion about one's salvation!



frankman -> RE: A Christian WILL NOT Continuously Sin! (3/31/2008 4:12:44 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Walker311

I do not believe a person is born-again if he/she continuously and unrepentantly sins.

Now, do you agree with the following statement? Why or why not.

A Christian WILL NOT Continuously Sin.


I`m glad the OP used the word "continuously" here. I`ll deal with the unrepentant sinner question in a moment. First I want to say there are some here who believe Christians don`t sin at all ever. To them I simply say no Christian is sinless, however true believers should sin-less.

If Christians continue to sin there will be ramifications. Your salvation will not save you from the consequences of your sins. You will in time face God`s loving discipline. You will loose heavenly rewards. You will loose the joy of your salvation. You will begin to doubt your salvation and as a result loose your inner assurance of the fact that you`ll go to heaven when you die. [sm=icon_smile_question.gif] Got any prayer requests? If your a Christian continuously living in sin don`t waste your time praying unless it`s a prayer of repentance for Ps.66:18 says "If I had cherished sin in my heart, the LORD would not have listened;" If I have to wonder if you were really saved in the first place because of your habitual unrepentant sinful life [sm=sadquestion.gif] what kind of a testimony is that to the world around you?

[sm=icon_smile_boggled.gif] Is one who continuously sins really saved? I`ll allow God to decide the answer to that question, for only God knows the heart of an individual. All I`ll dare say is people who are saved yet refuse to give up habitual sins are really hurting themselves, their Church and their loved ones around them.



Ephesians4_32 -> RE: A Christian WILL NOT Continuously Sin! (3/31/2008 4:27:26 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: rcjames
That what the folks in Matthew 7 thought, but found out otherwise.

They said "Lord, Lord", and he answered, "Depart from Me."


The people you are talking about in Matthew 7 were never "Stamped and sealed by the Holy Spirit for the day of Redemption."

The ones who are stamped and sealed are the ones the Father has brought to Christ. They are not the ones to whom He will say, "I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity."



Walker311 -> RE: A Christian WILL NOT Continuously Sin! (3/31/2008 5:45:51 PM)

I gave this thread much thought before I posted it and I appreciate the fact that many of you have carefully read, understood, and contributed to that effect.

It is not rocket science for the saved to understand that salvation was carefully planned and that sin was not meant to be a component of the mechanism. Sin, if not conquered... remember "we are more than conquerors", will either prove that an individual is saved or not. I'm not talking about being sinless here so don't get bent out of shape.

Many supposedly intelligent individuals have an excellent grasp on everything in the bible but where to put sin. They stretch and pull on scripture like it is salt water taffy, especially where Paul talks about his own struggle with sin. Because Paul struggled with a "thorn", does this mean that every Christian will do the same as if in a sticky sin web?

I meant to draw attention to the fact that we are to strive for perfection not take a spiritual pill for the symptoms.

Thankyou RC for your input and scripture. I was encouraged!

Liveloved,

quote:

Perhaps I should have worded it differently. Instead of "the closer you come to Jesus, the bigger sinner you are because you are aware of so much more", I could have said, "He reveals just how desperately wicked your heart is when you draw closer and closer to His."


I understand what you were getting at but it was the contradiction of getting closer to Christ but being a bigger sinner. This is not scriptural as in...
M't:5:48: Be ye therefore perfect, even as your Father which is in heaven is perfect.

Your wording waters down the ability of the Holy Spirit to perfect us by overcoming sin.
_________________________________________

I truly despise the fact that many Christians believe that they sin every day or must sin every day because they just cannot help it. I don't sin every day so does that make me a bigger Christian?

I don't say things like I am a sinner saved by grace... I say I WAS a sinner. I'm not fooling myself... I know I will slip up and probably in a bigger way than many of you but it is this mindset that I see in many Christians that we cannot control or stop the sin. That is not what the bible says that we can do.

I see Christianity as a constant layering of Holy Ghost shielding. That is what it is supposed to be as we go through so many storms in our lives. We learn, we grow, and it shows by how we act and what we do.



earthless -> RE: A Christian WILL NOT Continuously Sin! (3/31/2008 5:59:29 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Ephesians4_32

quote:

ORIGINAL: rcjames
That what the folks in Matthew 7 thought, but found out otherwise.

They said "Lord, Lord", and he answered, "Depart from Me."


The people you are talking about in Matthew 7 were never "Stamped and sealed by the Holy Spirit for the day of Redemption."

The ones who are stamped and sealed are the ones the Father has brought to Christ. They are not the ones to whom He will say, "I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity."


Exactly, the Lord's trees are evergreen....



ladyichigo -> RE: A Christian WILL NOT Continuously Sin! (3/31/2008 6:50:10 PM)

This issue has been on my mind for quite some time and I’m glad that there’s a post about it!! I had been thinking about asking a similar question.

I thought that when a person becomes a Christian, they believe Christ died for their sins, repent (turn away) of their old ways and accept Christ as their Master. They are supposed to become “a new creation”. And as a new creation they are to die to self every day and serve Christ their Lord. Yes, they are not perfect yet, and they still fall short at times, but they should strive to live a holy life through the Holy Spirit. Christians are people who are saved by God’s grace through faith, and they should live a life that reflects their Master, and not continuously live a life that reflects their old life.

I know so many people who say they are Christians, yet they still cling on to their old master. It’s like they have one foot placed in Christ, and the other foot placed in the world. They continue to live like they never accepted Christ yet they confess that He is their Savior and Lord. How is that possible?

How does a Christian serve 2 Masters?

I admit, I have days where I’m grumpy and I don’t have a loving attitude towards people and I think of wicked thoughts like putting a mannequin/dummy drenched in fake blood in the middle of our living room on the day of our apartment inspection just to get a kick out of the reaction from the inspector, but I cannot go back to how I was before I asked Christ into my life. I cannot deny His death, I cannot deny His resurrection, and I cannot deny His love for me. I don’t want to be living in sin. I want to live in Christ. I am not saying that I am always a righteous person, but I am striving every day to live in obedience through Christ who strengthens me.



jbow -> RE: A Christian WILL NOT Continuously Sin! (3/31/2008 9:51:20 PM)

quote:

I truly despise the fact that many Christians believe that they sin every day or must sin every day because they just cannot help it. I don't sin every day so does that make me a bigger Christian? I don't say things like I am a sinner saved by grace... I say I WAS a sinner. I'm not fooling myself... I know I will slip up and probably in a bigger way than many of you but it is this mindset that I see in many Christians that we cannot control or stop the sin. That is not what the bible says that we can do. I see Christianity as a constant layering of Holy Ghost shielding. That is what it is supposed to be as we go through so many storms in our lives. We learn, we grow, and it shows by how we act and what we do.


I agree Walker! Paul was pretty clear that if we walk in the Spirit we will NOT fulfill the lust of the flesh. John was clear that if we do we have an advocate with the Father... Jesus. I think the difference is in not attempting to justify our sin but in crying out to God for forgivness and help. The homosexual culture is a good example of people who fall into the former group, the justify their sin by saying the God made them that way and I am convinced that this is what God hate's so much about that sin or any sin... the lack or repentance, the lack or sorrow, of admission of guilt. God knows what we are we need to know and be willing to admit it.

I'll tell you this... God has been very good to me. He has been faithful in the face of my unfaithfulness. He has protected me from my enemy... my flesh... when I deserved defeat and humiliation. He bore my guilt and my shame and I am forever His. I love Him.

J



SonInMe1 -> RE: A Christian WILL NOT Continuously Sin! (4/1/2008 8:05:12 AM)

The old man didn't care too much about sinning. The new man cares a lot. The new man knows what is sin and what is not. A new man knows where to go with his sin. A new man is sanctified and will repent and will forgive.

A new man should never excuse his sin but I tell ya, unless my life is just radically different from the rest of you, sin repeats in my life. The sin challenges are always there and when I think they are defeated never to return...that...is when I am challenged the most.

I think when you think you have it all together...watch out, God will humble you.

I am not sure a repeated sin is a continual sin...guess it depends on frequency?



rcjames -> RE: A Christian WILL NOT Continuously Sin! (4/1/2008 10:41:57 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: earthless
As for continuing in sin? That is not what I and others mean.


Earthless the thread is about "Continuously Sinning", not occasionally but continuously sinning.

So I ask you. "Can a Christian continuously sin?"

As for me I say no, how about you?

Thanks
RC



Liveloved -> RE: A Christian WILL NOT Continuously Sin! (4/1/2008 11:07:15 AM)

quote:

the contradiction of getting closer to Christ but being a bigger sinner.


I do not think this is a contradiction at all and is at the very heart of the gospel. Yes, it is scriptural from Genesis through Revelation.

The closer I get to Jesus the more I understand the DEPTH of my depravity, the wickedness that lies within, that ONLY He can save me from!

If all we need is a little superficial cleaning up, we are the cup that Jesus refers to in Matthew 23. No, Jesus is talking about something more than a little scrubbing in the sink occasionally.

My view (and wording) were intended to place ALL of my salvation on Jesus and His perfection. The Holy Spirit's role is to glorify Christ. . .so when the Holy Spirit reveals my sin to me and I repent, Christ is being glorified.

I think this is a place where we as Christians do not live the gospel. The gospel is not about our being good but about our confessing our badness. And Jesus is the remedy! Hallelujah!



Liveloved -> RE: A Christian WILL NOT Continuously Sin! (4/1/2008 11:26:28 AM)

quote:

Your use of the word 'continuously' is interesting. Do you really mean 'continuously' as in uninterrupted, nonstop? or 'continually' which is frequent or repeatedly?


I am quoting myself---from my original post since others are wondering this as well.

Continuous is uninterrupted, nonstop. A Christian cannot be here.

Continual is frequent or repeatedly. A Christian is here.

That does not mean we CHOOSE sin. But we do sin. The Holy Spirit makes that known to us. That is why we are to live in continual REPENTANCE as well.[:)]



earthless -> RE: A Christian WILL NOT Continuously Sin! (4/1/2008 11:28:18 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: rcjames

quote:

ORIGINAL: earthless
As for continuing in sin? That is not what I and others mean.


Earthless the thread is about "Continuously Sinning", not occasionally but continuously sinning.

So I ask you. "Can a Christian continuously sin?"

As for me I say no, how about you?

Thanks
RC


No.

So we agree! Sorry, I was lacking coffee yesterday. [&:]



rcjames -> RE: A Christian WILL NOT Continuously Sin! (4/1/2008 12:42:44 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: earthless
No.

So we agree! Sorry, I was lacking coffee yesterday. [&:]


Earthless, we agree on a whole lot more than we disagree on.

Thanks
RC



hawkfan428 -> RE: A Christian WILL NOT Continuously Sin! (4/1/2008 1:06:55 PM)

OK, if the intent of this thread was about constantly sinning vice the occasional sin, then I agree with RC. The various posts here seemed to indicate that we never sin at all



jfaye -> RE: A Christian WILL NOT Continuously Sin! (4/1/2008 1:11:14 PM)

quote:

Earthless, we agree on a whole lot more than we disagree on.

Thanks
RC


Yeah, you really don't wanna to be in disagreement with a 'horse with a gun', in my mind![;)][:D]



MrsOliver -> RE: A Christian WILL NOT Continuously Sin! (4/1/2008 1:34:02 PM)

Wow!! I just have to say WOW!!!
Who are we to #1 judge sin? I mean the sin of others? As if it is "more' serious than our own!
Walker, I wonder what is that 'cross' you bare? What is your 'sin' battle, Because we all fall short of the Glory of God!! that really does mean ALL!!!
I just have to say, Judge, and YOU WILL BE judged!
Are you suggesting that "living in sin, or rather not married", loving Jesus if you are homosexual, etc...I guess these "major sins" in your eyes are some how less desirable in the eyes of God, than lets say, over eating, swearing, JUDGING, unkindness, etc.
IF someone could please point me to that scripture! The one that says what you are suggesting, I would understand better. I don't beleive I have EVER seen scripture that states which sin, is more or less great in the eyes of God!

I don't get it...why do some of us seem so indignant about our own "perfection' and choose to judge those who have not mastered what you have? As it appears,and please correct me if I am wrong.

I guess, I feel it more necessary to discuss how to love!! Love in spite of ALL OF OUR IMPERFECTIONS!!! Instead of discussing, the 'degree' of sin that we should judge...

I love the input on here, especially liveloved!! thank you for your boldness!

Mrs. O



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