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[Poll]
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What is your opinion about denominations?
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| They are of the devil! |
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| They are divisive. |
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| They are helpful for knowing a church's doctrine. |
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| They are a necessary evil. |
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| There's nothing wrong with them. |
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| They are all cults (excpt mine, of course). |
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| Denominations are a part of God's plan. |
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| Other |
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Total Votes : 68
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(last vote on : 7/5/2008 3:09:44 AM)
(Poll will run till: -- )
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RE: What is your opinion about denominations? - 4/9/2008 9:10:24 AM
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P31W
Posts: 1923
Joined: 6/13/2005
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I voted it's helpful and there is nothing wrong with it.
To me having differant denominations within the body of Christ is not differant than having differant services with their differant styles of preaching and music in the same church. I honestly think it's a "good thing".
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RE: What is your opinion about denominations? - 4/9/2008 5:38:02 PM
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called2valor
Posts: 73
Joined: 3/13/2006
From: Minnesota
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I voted divisive...
However, I don't think denominations in themselves are necessarily bad, just that I have had some crazy experiences with some.
I quit one denomination because I could not in good faith preach what the denomination wanted me to and believe it... I would be telling a false Gospel and dooming myself and perhaps leading others down a wrong path.
People need somewhere to worship and if it isn't a cell group or home church or something, it is going to be a church building and most are part of a denomination.
Pastors and churches even within a denomination vary, so I just pray that we all are discerning when we enter into fellowship with any group.
Some people I know say that all denominations are of Satan... I am more worried about individuals being for Christ and being spiritual discerning... that way they can avoid any potential denominational issues. I do see some denominations as generally being exclusive clubs or homes for doctrines of devils, but I won't say all.
We are all part of the Body, and serve our LORD, not a denomination. If we keep that straight, then we won't be swayed by the teachings of men and even if we did get off the track a bit because of denominationalism creeping in, we would hopefully quickly be brought back into alignment with the will of God by the working of the Spirit in us :)
I know that God helped me in that area and He is more powerful than the deceptions out there.
Peace
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RE: What is your opinion about denominations? - 4/10/2008 12:12:26 AM
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walterquez
Posts: 1375
Joined: 4/12/2005
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It is definitely divisive. St Paul rebuke some, because one said I am of Paul, I am of Apollos, I am of Jesus, etc...
The problem is not having different groups with their own unique customs. There is nothing wrong with this. It is that each group adheres to different doctrines. There is no unity of faith. If all the groups agreed to the same faith, and were also in communion with each other, that would be great, but unfortunately, this is not the case. One group believes in speaking in tongues, another in baby baptism, another in women pastors, another in cookies and grape juice, another in submersion, and so on and so on. There is no unity of faith.
Also, if you don't like one group, you go to another, or you start another with your own personal doctrines.
Would it be great that no matter where you went to, the faith is the same? That the only difference would only be cultural?
_____________________________
St. Athanasius the Great
For our Canons and our forms were not given to the Churches at the present day, but were wisely and safely transmitted to us from our forefathers.
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RE: What is your opinion about denominations? - 4/16/2008 5:48:48 AM
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Tomb
Posts: 265
Joined: 8/31/2007
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Consecrated2God
Do you think that having different denominations in the body of Christ is a good thing or not?
1. The bible does not speak kindly about divisions (1Cor.1:10-13) (Phil.3:16,17).
Check this out if you have the time.
http://www.gbntv.org/
OR
http://missionprinting.us/mp_newindex.html
Click on publications.
Then pick the topic your curious about (Acts 17:11).
in love tomb
_____________________________
missionprinting.us - - click on publications
gospelpreceptor.com
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RE: What is your opinion about denominations? - 4/25/2008 10:06:03 PM
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GrapeApe
Posts: 8543
Joined: 6/5/2006
From: the Land Where My Jokes come From.
Status: offline
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I loathe them with every ounce of my mortal body.
_____________________________
your love cuts like a knife into the darkest part of me.
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RE: What is your opinion about denominations? - 4/25/2008 10:28:44 PM
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AoibhinnGrainne
Posts: 103
Status: offline
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Ephesians 4:2-6 ~ 2 Always be humble, gentle and patient, bearing with one another in love, 3 and making every effort to preserve the unity the Spirit gives through the binding power of shalom. 4 There is one body and one Spirit, just as when you were called you were called to one hope. 5 And there is one Lord, one trust, one immersion, 6 and one God, the Father of all, who rules over all, works through all and is in all.
Actually, denominationalism began before the time of the Great Schism, 1054, when the Eastern Church and the Western Church finalised a division that had begun in the 2nd century.
Many of the things we think of as "denominational" can be traced historically to the time of Constantine. Scripture is remarkably silent on practice; much is inferred; ergo, the divisions that often arise between brothers of good faith. Even non-denominationalism and house church have their own traditions, practice, vocabulary and cultural constructs. Thay have become "denominations", albeit loosely defined.
It saddens me. I read Acts and Corinthians and I feel as if I am missing sooooo much!
I am not so naive as to believe that theirs was a perfect church. But, having seen the Church behind closed doors, in countries where Christians are persecuted, it does tend to strip away the minors and bring everyone to a common denominator, as articulated by Paul, above, in Ephesians.
And, perhaps, that was the undoing of the Early Church. Wealth and Security. We have the luxury of arguing over the colour of the carpet...
Aoi.
_____________________________
Be a woman so wrapped up in the Heart of God, that a Man of God has to search the Heart of God to find you...
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RE: What is your opinion about denominations? - 4/25/2008 11:46:49 PM
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Cloak
Posts: 3308
Joined: 1/4/2008
From: Canada
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They are of the devil!
_____________________________
And My God shall meet ALL Your Needs according to His glorious riches in Christ Jesus. (Philippians 4: 19)
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RE: What is your opinion about denominations? - 4/26/2008 10:04:53 AM
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rcjames
Posts: 4623
Joined: 7/15/2005
From: Oklahoma
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Cloak
They are of the devil!
Would you care to qualify that statement?
Thanks
RC
_____________________________
Just a country Preacher's humble opinion
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RE: What is your opinion about denominations? - 4/26/2008 3:02:05 PM
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Cloak
Posts: 3308
Joined: 1/4/2008
From: Canada
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rcjames~
To put it in a nut shell: If you go back to history - mind you I studied history at school but forgot many infos about many details - you will find that the Holy Catholic (Universal) church was ONE. ONE Holy Catholic Church. I don't mean here the Roman Catholic Church. The word Catholic means (Universal).
The early Roman Empire was at first non-Christian, then when the Romans converted to Christianity, the were unified in one single Catholic church. Then some conflicts took place between The eastern Roman Empire [Constantinople] and The western Roman Empire [Rome] which, tragically, resulted in separation between the two Empires.
Later on in Europe, since most of west Europe was under the Roman Catholic Empire, the RC Church was persecuting people and promising them by doing certain things to go to heaven {I believe it's during the French Revolution} which made many people revolt against the RCC and thus led to the emergence of Martin Luther and the Protestant Movement which spread in West and north Europe.
Ultimately, I strongly believe that All STRIFE, CONFLICTS, CONTENTIONS come from Satan NOT from God.
Satan is the author of war, strife, confusion, complexities, wrath and anything negative and love and peace -hindering.
The Bible says: "And finally, whatever things are true, noble, just, pure, lovely, of good report, having virtue, or anything praiseworthy, let us think/dwell on these things. (Philippians 4:8).
Since Satan is the enemy of God, that means anything the opposite of this not from God but rather from Satan.
_____________________________
And My God shall meet ALL Your Needs according to His glorious riches in Christ Jesus. (Philippians 4: 19)
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RE: What is your opinion about denominations? - 4/26/2008 5:17:32 PM
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rcjames
Posts: 4623
Joined: 7/15/2005
From: Oklahoma
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Cloak
Ultimately, I strongly believe that All STRIFE, CONFLICTS, CONTENTIONS come from Satan NOT from God.
Satan is the author of war, strife, confusion, complexities, wrath and anything negative and love and peace -hindering.
So you think denominations are all about strife, conflict, contentions, confusion, complexiites, wrath, negative, and love and peace hinderinjg.
Wow, where in the world and what denominations have you been around.
My particular Church and its denomination is all about love, and serving Christ. we might believe the the baptism of the Holy Spirit and others do not, might believe in complete sactification, and others might not; but there in no strife, conflict, contention etc. that you refer to.
Thanks
RC
_____________________________
Just a country Preacher's humble opinion
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RE: What is your opinion about denominations? - 4/26/2008 5:49:53 PM
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AoibhinnGrainne
Posts: 103
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: rcjames
quote:
ORIGINAL: Cloak
Ultimately, I strongly believe that All STRIFE, CONFLICTS, CONTENTIONS come from Satan NOT from God.
Satan is the author of war, strife, confusion, complexities, wrath and anything negative and love and peace -hindering.
So you think denominations are all about strife, conflict, contentions, confusion, complexiites, wrath, negative, and love and peace hinderinjg.
Wow, where in the world and what denominations have you been around.
My particular Church and its denomination is all about love, and serving Christ. we might believe the the baptism of the Holy Spirit and others do not, might believe in complete sactification, and others might not; but there in no strife, conflict, contention etc. that you refer to.
Thanks
RC
I just got married this past January after almost three years of Widowhood (married to my first Husband almost 29 years). In fact, today is my three-month Anniversary  !
Please...my new Husband and I have been looking for a Church together since we have both decided to settle down in my region of the country rather than his (economic reasons).
Where do you go to Church, rcjames? If there is one such as yours close to us we would like to visit.
Thank you!
Aoi.
PS: PM me if you'd prefer...
_____________________________
Be a woman so wrapped up in the Heart of God, that a Man of God has to search the Heart of God to find you...
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RE: What is your opinion about denominations? - 4/26/2008 5:53:44 PM
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Covaan_Meshuga
Posts: 2641
Joined: 6/8/2005
Status: offline
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Perhaps G-d should have told us all that all places of worship may only identify their places of worship with a singular 2' by 6' sign which merely says, "Place of Worship." You might be able to tell something about the kind of worship by the architecture, but maybe not. After all, I was once a member of a cultish church in my town that met in a building that had once been a synagogue. There are many store-front gatherings here, too. There is even a tiny baptist congregation meeting in a large old building that, from the outside, looks like typical old Roman Catholic churches. There are additionally people worshiping in school auditoriums, mosques, parks, homes, etc. So we would walk in and just have to take what we get.
There are those who decry worshipers who travel distances to reach their places of worship. Suppose G-d wrote, "Thou shalt attend with the congregation nearest wherever you happen to be on the day of worship." So where might you end up? I would end up in the church down the street where I did attend once, and they were controlling to the nth degree as well as very rude, demanding, and commanding. Further, the lady the pastor forced to sit with me lied to me.
Better, in my opinion, that we can look at a sign and get a good guess at what they hold as dear with regard to worship.
When I was preparing to leave the cultish church mentioned above, i had much to learn about names of places of worship. Indeed, when carefully attended to, we can learn a lot about that place of worship, so we can avoid some that we recognize as not biblical and aim for the ones that we hope will be closer to the truth. Hence denominational names; and when we come across nondenominational gatherings, we can also already tell quite a bit about them as well.
< Message edited by Covaan_Meshuga -- 4/26/2008 6:00:26 PM >
_____________________________
Abiyah
Why does He keep quoting Torah? Doesn't He know He's about to abolish it?
A tree's fruit is obvious; you have to look harder for the worm hole.
G-d has only one natural Son; EVERYONE else is adopted.
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RE: What is your opinion about denominations? - 4/26/2008 6:04:26 PM
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rcjames
Posts: 4623
Joined: 7/15/2005
From: Oklahoma
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: AoibhinnGrainne
Where do you go to Church, rcjames? If there is one such as yours close to us we would like to visit.
Thank you!
Aoi.
PS: PM me if you'd prefer...
PM on the way.
Covaan_Meshuga
Hey Abiyah, how you been? My wife and I still pray for you daily.
Thanks
RC
_____________________________
Just a country Preacher's humble opinion
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RE: What is your opinion about denominations? - 4/26/2008 6:36:12 PM
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walterquez
Posts: 1375
Joined: 4/12/2005
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: rcjamesquote:
ORIGINAL: Cloak
Ultimately, I strongly believe that All STRIFE, CONFLICTS, CONTENTIONS come from Satan NOT from God.
Satan is the author of war, strife, confusion, complexities, wrath and anything negative and love and peace -hindering.
So you think denominations are all about strife, conflict, contentions, confusion, complexiites, wrath, negative, and love and peace hinderinjg.
Wow, where in the world and what denominations have you been around.
My particular Church and its denomination is all about love, and serving Christ. we might believe the the baptism of the Holy Spirit and others do not, might believe in complete sactification, and others might not; but there in no strife, conflict, contention etc. that you refer to. But here you're talking about within your own group. Is your group in communion with all the other Protestant groups? Will yours and other denominations allow joint fellowship, including having ministers leading the service, taking communion, baptism? Or even have a simple event as a picnic with "all" the other denominations?
If you can't have these, then there is certainly strife, confusion, complexities, wrath and anything that is negative.
But even within your own group, when you have bible studies, do you have full agreement on the faith once given, or are there some with their own private interpretations? I personally have not been to a single bible study where everyone were in agreement. Instead, each person had their own private interpretation. Of course, there were a few points where everyone agreed, because that is one of the main teachings of that group. But aside from these, there are no agreements. Despite the fact that each may claim the bible as the sole authority, their interpretations is what really matters.
_____________________________
St. Athanasius the Great
For our Canons and our forms were not given to the Churches at the present day, but were wisely and safely transmitted to us from our forefathers.
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RE: What is your opinion about denominations? - 4/26/2008 7:07:07 PM
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rcjames
Posts: 4623
Joined: 7/15/2005
From: Oklahoma
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: walterquez
But here you're talking about within your own group. Is your group in communion with all the other Protestant groups? Will yours and other denominations allow joint fellowship, including having ministers leading the service, taking communion, baptism? Or even have a simple event as a picnic with "all" the other denominations?
If you can't have these, then there is certainly strife, confusion, complexities, wrath and anything that is negative.
We have joint fellowship, joint services, etc. on a regular basis. We are full gospel holiness and I am having a SBC Pastor speak tomorrow morning, And we are open to all except those considered to be cults such as UPC, Mormons, Jehovah Witnesses.
quote:
But even within your own group, when you have bible studies, do you have full agreement on the faith once given, or are there some with their own private interpretations? I personally have not been to a single bible study where everyone were in agreement. Instead, each person had their own private interpretation. Of course, there were a few points where everyone agreed, because that is one of the main teachings of that group. But aside from these, there are no agreements. Despite the fact that each may claim the bible as the sole authority, their interpretations is what really matters.
I teach 9 Bible studies a week and we never have strife, sometime there are civil discussions and we study the Word until all come to unity on all salvic issues.
Also am I to understand that there is never a member of the EOC that has a question concerning their doctrine?
Walter, I think you have a misconsception about denominations (as does cload), But the cat fights that you seem to believe are common to denominations: I have not seem in over 45 years of ministry in a denomination.
Thanks
RC
_____________________________
Just a country Preacher's humble opinion
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RE: What is your opinion about denominations? - 4/26/2008 7:09:06 PM
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Covaan_Meshuga
Posts: 2641
Joined: 6/8/2005
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: rcjames
Hey Abiyah, how you been? My wife and I still pray for you daily.
Thanks
RC
Hey! Doing all right. Lots of serious illness in the family, so far less leisure (i.e. computer) time.
This subject caught my eye, then when I saw you were, I had to sign in! Thank you for your prayers -- they are SO appreciated!
_____________________________
Abiyah
Why does He keep quoting Torah? Doesn't He know He's about to abolish it?
A tree's fruit is obvious; you have to look harder for the worm hole.
G-d has only one natural Son; EVERYONE else is adopted.
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RE: What is your opinion about denominations? - 4/26/2008 7:30:24 PM
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zoebob
Posts: 8915
Joined: 4/13/2005
From: land of limbo
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: walterquez
quote:
ORIGINAL: rcjamesquote:
ORIGINAL: Cloak
Ultimately, I strongly believe that All STRIFE, CONFLICTS, CONTENTIONS come from Satan NOT from God.
Satan is the author of war, strife, confusion, complexities, wrath and anything negative and love and peace -hindering.
So you think denominations are all about strife, conflict, contentions, confusion, complexiites, wrath, negative, and love and peace hinderinjg.
Wow, where in the world and what denominations have you been around.
My particular Church and its denomination is all about love, and serving Christ. we might believe the the baptism of the Holy Spirit and others do not, might believe in complete sactification, and others might not; but there in no strife, conflict, contention etc. that you refer to. But here you're talking about within your own group. Is your group in communion with all the other Protestant groups? Will yours and other denominations allow joint fellowship, including having ministers leading the service, taking communion, baptism? Or even have a simple event as a picnic with "all" the other denominations?
If you can't have these, then there is certainly strife, confusion, complexities, wrath and anything that is negative.
But even within your own group, when you have bible studies, do you have full agreement on the faith once given, or are there some with their own private interpretations? I personally have not been to a single bible study where everyone were in agreement. Instead, each person had their own private interpretation. Of course, there were a few points where everyone agreed, because that is one of the main teachings of that group. But aside from these, there are no agreements. Despite the fact that each may claim the bible as the sole authority, their interpretations is what really matters.
I'm not RC but I go to a denominational church and say that yes, our church has no problems getting together with and fellowshipping with other denominations. You talked earlier about the universal catholic church (not RCC but Christianity). Most Christian denominations would agree that other Christian denominations are part of the universal catholic church. In this town and the last town that I went to there is fellowship between the churches. Every week our pastor prays for the church around the world, around the country, around the county, and in our town. We support and are involved with several interdenominational ministries.
At least twice a year we have a quarterly sunday school class for new people and potential members that goes over everything that makes our denomination what it is. However, it is repeatedly said that we are not the only Christian denomination and there are many Christian congregations out there. Of course he thinks that our denomination has it correct or he wouldn't be in this denomination...he would go find that denomination that he thinks IS right or start his own independent church. In this SS class he always says that God isn't XYZ denomination (and follows up with a joke...but why risk it. However, this is just a joke and he makes it very clear). We are a fairly conservative denomination too. We don't think that anything goes. Certain things are essential. other points we think we interpret correctly but don't hold to be essential to be Christian. This is where denominations come in. They allow us to say that all these groups are Christian but we look at things a little differently. In our congregation we will look at things through this filter and have these certain presuppositions. Other filters may be right also or instead but this is the one we believe is most Biblical.
I have been to congregations of other denominations and because I know I look at things through a different "filter" I could never study some topics or passages as deeply as I could if I was using the same filter at the others. For example, look at many of the threads on this board that ask a question. Some people will say no, because.... Others say yes, because... They have different filters. How you answer the question will be based on which filter you use. However, the answer to that particular question is not essential to salvation. However, if you can discuss the topic with people who view it the same way as you do, you can delve into the topic deeper and see better the glory and love of God because of how He works in a particular way. If you can't agree on the basic answer to the topic you can't get there though because you are stuck reinventing the spiritual wheel so to speak.
_____________________________
L-R: DD1, Ellies DS2, DD2, Ellies DS1
L-R: Ellies DD1, Ellies DD2, DS, Ellies DS3
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RE: What is your opinion about denominations? - 4/26/2008 7:36:51 PM
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walterquez
Posts: 1375
Joined: 4/12/2005
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: rcjames
We have joint fellowship, joint services, etc. on a regular basis. We are full gospel holiness and I am having a SBC Pastor speak tomorrow morning I was not talking about having a guest speaker. Joint with "all" Protestants? LCMS, ELCA, SBC, PCA, PCUSA, Anglicans, Methodists, AOG, and others? Are you allowed to take communion in any of them? How about water baptism? If someone was baptized as an infant in one of the others, is that good enough for you? Or for the other denominations in general?
quote:
I teach 9 Bible studies a week and we never have strife, sometime there are civil discussions and we study the Word until all come to unity on all salvic issues. Why did you end with, "until all come to unity"? And then "on all salvic issues"? Who determines what is salvic and what is not, since each denomination have their own take on it?
quote:
Also am I to understand that there is never a member of the EOC that has a question concerning their doctrine? I don't think having question is what we're talking about, but about having a different position.
quote:
Walter, I think you have a misconsception about denominations (as does cload), But the cat fights that you seem to believe are common to denominations: I have not seem in over 45 years of ministry in a denomination. You said the cat fights are common to denominations, but then you said you have not seen one. I am sorry, I did not understand this.
I don't think there are cat fights among the different denominations. I think what we have is passive aggression. Many manifest resentments toward other denoms, or have a feeling of superiority believing they are closer to the truth than the rest. How many times have I heard charismatics talk about a baptist, to pray for this person that God will save him. Or vice versa.
Or the people in this other denom are our brothers and sisters, but they are confused about this other thing which we know better.
_____________________________
St. Athanasius the Great
For our Canons and our forms were not given to the Churches at the present day, but were wisely and safely transmitted to us from our forefathers.
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RE: What is your opinion about denominations? - 4/26/2008 7:40:26 PM
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walterquez
Posts: 1375
Joined: 4/12/2005
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Cloak
What time Walter? I can't wait too. Easter is the big feast for me!!! I'll be there around 10:30 - 11pm to help with some preparation, and will have the service until 1 or 2 in the morning.
_____________________________
St. Athanasius the Great
For our Canons and our forms were not given to the Churches at the present day, but were wisely and safely transmitted to us from our forefathers.
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RE: What is your opinion about denominations? - 4/26/2008 7:44:22 PM
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Cloak
Posts: 3308
Joined: 1/4/2008
From: Canada
Status: offline
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I wish I could have a church like yours zoebob. This is the ideal Christian church and how it should be. I believe we are all brothers and sisters and should love one another.
I hope and pray when I relocate, I will find a church similar to yours!
I strongly believe that this biblical verse is the Foremost verse that sums up the whole Scripture when Jesus Christ said: "A new commandment I give you: Love one another. As I have loved you, so you must love one another. By this all men will know that you are my disciples, if you love one another." (John 13:34-35).
< Message edited by Cloak -- 4/26/2008 10:31:24 PM >
_____________________________
And My God shall meet ALL Your Needs according to His glorious riches in Christ Jesus. (Philippians 4: 19)
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