RE: Socialism should be taught in school at a greater level

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1dblthnk02 -> RE: Socialism should be taught in school at a greater level (5/6/2008 3:20:38 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: TomTurn Just go to the passing students and say "your grade is not earned for your schoolwork, it is just a reflection of your intelligence Why would I say this? I never said that grades reflect intelligence. Let's be clear: there is learning, and there is intelligence. These are two different things. One can be unlearned, yet innately intelligent. But whether a student is gifted or of average intelligence, any can learn the same material. The difference is that the average kid has to try harder to learn than the above-average kid. Both can get an A, but the A does not directly reflect the degree of effort that went into getting the grade. Now do you get it? quote: That is my last post on grades = earned through work since it is obvious we are not going to agree. This is only due to your inflexibility when it comes to deciphering flaws in your logic.

ElmerFishpaw -> RE: Socialism should be taught in school at a greater level (5/6/2008 4:46:00 PM)
Just a few thoughts regarding the thread here. Some things/institutions in life are for the common good. Now I live up near Quebec. If I go over the border to Montreal for the day, and use the roads and bridges and the bathroom at the highway rest stops, am I a leach off the Canadian taxpayer? Let's say I go to South Carolina let's say, and I do the same. Am I leech on the good citizens of South Carolina? Of Course not. I'm not even if I spend no money in either place just passing through without stopping. Certain things are for the common good an use of all. That I think we can all agree on. I think the argument is to what extent. I believe the public schools should teach the idea of a society sharing things in common...team playing and all..as well as academics. I mean the State Police should never be put out to bid to the lowest bidder. I don't want to buy a $400 wind up wrist watch from the government owned department store either. In discussions like this I try to be careful to point out a few things.....I'm a left winger, but not a "liberal". I think people confuse these two words and assume they mean about the same thing...they don't. Also we Christians say "We/I are not part of the 'world'" Well, if you aren't part of it, then don't try to dictate policy in it. Folks, we are all ....everyone....in this world together. If you are a Christian, and you have chest pains and the person next to you has a cell phone, really, you don't care if they worship trees, Stalin, Marx or even Satan...you need them period, and you won't ask their beliefs. Finally, I trust my government ----in theory----more than private enterprise in this way. At least with government, the citizen in theory (again) has some power. You can research government records, elect officials etc....it seems since 1980 or so, Corporate power has surpassed government power (the people...I guess nowadays in theory) and that's bad.....the economy should serve the people and not vice versa.

1dblthnk02 -> RE: Socialism should be taught in school at a greater level (5/6/2008 5:20:09 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: ElmerFishpaw At least with government, the citizen in theory (again) has some power. Only if there is some form of democracy involved in said government. quote: You can research government records, elect officials etc....it seems since 1980 or so, Corporate power has surpassed government power (the people...I guess nowadays in theory) and that's bad.....the economy should serve the people and not vice versa. And this is a worldwide phenomenon, believe it or not. Everyone in every country serves corporate powers to various degrees.

radiorobert -> RE: Socialism should be taught in school at a greater level (5/6/2008 5:24:27 PM)
quote: This is why I do not prefer the justice of the God of the bible. Well, I'm glad you've come out and said exactly where you stand. That gives me all the info I need. Perhaps in time, the holy spirit will work in your heart to draw you to Christ. I will pray for you.

TomTurn -> RE: Socialism should be taught in school at a greater level (5/6/2008 5:38:30 PM)
quote: Why would I say this? I never said that grades reflect intelligence. If I read, "Grades are a scale of evaluation, a meter to measure scholastic" wrong, then apologize. Let's be clear: there is learning, and there is intelligence. These are two different things. One can be unlearned, yet innately intelligent. But whether a student is gifted or of average intelligence, any can learn the same material. The difference is that the average kid has to try harder to learn than the above-average kid. Both can get an A, but the A does not directly reflect the degree of effort that went into getting the grade. Now do you get it? Said earlier I understood where you were coming from. One student may have a natural higher IQ than the other. Another may have a natural gifet for the subject. That does not mean that IQ is fixed and it does not mean a student did not earn the grade they made. Yes it means one might mae a grade higher than the other with less effort. It does not remove the fact that the grade was earned Now do you get that you can continue this till the cows come home but it does not remove the fact that a student earns their grade. quote: This is only due to your inflexibility when it comes to deciphering flaws in your logic. No I made the statement to try and get away somewhat politely from your lack of understanding the english language. I guess polite is out the door. Have defined for you no less than 3 times what earn means. You may have something against the school system, you may be a flaming socialist, you may be a no walls school advocate, you my be right of John Birch but none of that will remove or change the definiton of the word earn So lets quit digging the hole on the word earn ........ quote: collectivism is fair and impartial. However, that which is truly fair and impartial does not automatically make something desirable. Therefore, it is a bit contradictory to say that socialism is bad because it is unfair when, if fact, it is fair in many ways. You do not qualify for John Birch (-: And how would collectivism be fair and impartial. To collect you would have to be taking from someone who had something to collect from, to give to another. How is that impartial or even fair? quote: To not distinguish the condition of one individual from another is collectivism, and collectivism is the heart of socialistic ideals. Then how do you know who to collect from?

1dblthnk02 -> RE: Socialism should be taught in school at a greater level (5/6/2008 6:11:31 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: TomTurn If I read, "Grades are a scale of evaluation, a meter to measure scholastic" wrong, then apologize. You also quoted it wrong. Oh, well . . . quote: Yes it means one might mae a grade higher than the other with less effort. It does not remove the fact that the grade was earned No, you said in post #42 that grades reflect effort. Earning is effort. I am showing you where this is not necessarily so concerning grades. Now you apparently see that this is so, but you can't see your own previous error even though I have spelled it out . . . quote: Now do you get that you can continue this till the cows come home but it does not remove the fact that a student earns their grade. . . . and I rest my case. quote: No I made the statement to try and get away somewhat politely from your lack of understanding the english language. I guess polite is out the door. Well, since "polite is out the door," I think that it is only fair to point out that if writing skills reflect an understanding of the English language, I clearly have the advantage. quote: Have defined for you no less than 3 times what earn means. Yes, no matter how many times I tell you that I am familiar with the word "earn." quote: So lets quit digging the hole on the word earn "Let's?" I am not the one beating the dead horse of the definition of "earn." quote: And how would collectivism be fair and impartial. To collect you would have to be taking from someone who had something to collect from, to give to another. How is that impartial or even fair? Because it has nothing to do with merit. Fair and impartial does not recognize personal merit, or personal effort. quote: Then how do you know who to collect from? Whomever has something to collect, no matter how they came to possess it in the first place.

ElmerFishpaw -> RE: Socialism should be taught in school at a greater level (5/6/2008 6:22:02 PM)
"Spout" I hope you didn't mean that in an insulting way. More than a few Socialists I'm sure have well thought out and intelligent opinions. quote: ORIGINAL: TomTurn That is a great story. One more thing before I go for the day "If a student makes a 100 on a test, they should be forced to take an 85 by giving 15 of their points to a student who made a 55, thereby assuring the failed grade 55 student gets a passing grade of 70 and can be more close to the 100 student without further work". That is the heart of socialism and I would like you here who spout socialist ideals all the time to defend it.

Ruthie -> RE: Socialism should be taught in school at a greater level (5/6/2008 7:29:29 PM)
1dblthnk02, I have to both agree and disagree with you at the same time. While you are technically correct that grades should be a mere evaluation of a student's grasp of a subject, people still think of grades as being earned, not unlike money. Common language refers to grades as being earned, school being a kid's 'job' and so on. The mindset is very entrenched, at least where I come from. So while you may be right in principle, I believe that you are wrong in how grades are really viewed. And by the way, grades can, and are used, as punishment or reward. I witnessed it happen with my own eyes. A professor cheated my friend Emily out of her rightful grade because he didn't like the ethnicity of another friend of hers. Even though she had proof that the grade was undeserved, and the teacher didn't deny it, the Dean didn't want to override the professor's grade. This has to be the one time that having a muscle degenerative disorder (myopathy?) was a positive thing. She threatened to sue for discrimination = the Dean overrode the grade. So while education should be an impartial affair of teaching students and evaluating their progress, in practice its not even close. Every school I've been in has been like a bizarre little fusion of North Korea and Enron. The education system is its own weird world.

TomTurn -> RE: Socialism should be taught in school at a greater level (5/6/2008 8:29:11 PM)
quote: More than a few Socialists I'm sure have well thought out and intelligent opinions In my opinion, if it were well thought out, it would not be from a socialist.

TomTurn -> RE: Socialism should be taught in school at a greater level (5/6/2008 8:33:26 PM)
quote: nor does He [God] ultimately reward those who do good. Acutaully, in Heaven some will be rewarded more than others How does that figure into "God is a socialist" type ideas?

1dblthnk02 -> RE: Socialism should be taught in school at a greater level (5/6/2008 11:09:32 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Ruthie 1dblthnk02, I have to both agree and disagree with you at the same time. Nothing wrong with that. quote: While you are technically correct that grades should be a mere evaluation of a student's grasp of a subject, people still think of grades as being earned, not unlike money. Yes, they do. TomTurn certainly does. quote: So while you may be right in principle, I believe that you are wrong in how grades are really viewed. Actually, I made no comment about how grades are viewed. People like TomTurn entertain many mistaken notions, but that doesn't change the basic truth of something. However, you are correct about the principle. You are also correct that this principle is violated over and over by people who see education as a commodity of grades and rewards. Such people lack a correct concept of what education really means. quote: So while education should be an impartial affair of teaching students and evaluating their progress, in practice its not even close. Humans are flawed. The real tragedy is when the system itself reflects human flaws more than human ideals. Again I say that this may very well be why our current system churns out so many dullards with diplomas. quote: Every school I've been in has been like a bizarre little fusion of North Korea and Enron. The education system is its own weird world. Sad, isn't it. Unless, of course, you think like Tom . . . quote: ORIGINAL: TomTurn Acutaully, in Heaven some will be rewarded more than others Maybe this will be true in heaven, but I do know that scripture says that here on earth: God is not a respector of persons, that He makes the rain to fall on the righteous and the unrighteous, and that sinners get blessed just as surely as righteous men get the shaft (paraphrased from Ecclesiastes). quote: How does that figure into "God is a socialist" type ideas? I never said that "God is a socialist." I said that God is fair and impartial, according to the bible. Fairness and impartiality are intrinsic to collectivism, and collectivism is intrinsic to socialism. So, this separates God from socialism by at least two steps.

violinist_for_jesus -> RE: Socialism should be taught in school at a greater level (5/7/2008 12:33:17 AM)
About time we teach socialism! At least we can now admit that we deny God. sheesh...

mapachito13 -> RE: Socialism should be taught in school at a greater level (5/7/2008 7:42:30 AM)
Acts 4:32-35 "The community of believers were of one heart and one mind. None of them ever claimed anything as his own; rather, everything was held in common. With power the apostles bore witness to the resurrection of the Lord Jesus and great respect was paid to them all; nor was there anyone needy among them, for all who owned property or houses sold them and donated the proceeds. They used to lay them at the feet of the apostles to be distributed to everyone according to his need." And what if I refuse to do that? Will the fate of Ananias and Sapphira befall me? (Acts 5:1-11) Crazy! Sounds like socialism to me! The apostles distributed someone's personal belonging and fortune to all. So they were like a socialistic mini-state. How unfair to the rich guys! So then, is Christian based socialism (as opposed to atheistic socialism) acceptable? Just pouring more gas on the fire, boys and girls!

TomTurn -> RE: Socialism should be taught in school at a greater level (5/7/2008 8:28:18 AM)
quote: Crazy! Sounds like socialism to me! The apostles distributed someone's personal belonging and fortune to all. So they were like a socialistic mini-state. How unfair to the rich guys! So then, is Christian based socialism (as opposed to atheistic socialism) acceptable? Why did you not highlight this part and discuss it and all in context? "The community of believers were of one heart and one mind". Or are you inviting the rest of us to post things out of context also? ok here are some from me, maybe others have some they would like to post "Slaves, submit yourselves to your masters with all respect, not only to those who are good and considerate, but also to those who are harsh". - Guess all that slavery stuff in U.S. history was not such a bad thing and it getting stopped the way it was went against Him "If anyone will not work, neither shall he eat". - There it is, straight from the Bible. If you are in bad health and I offer you a job you will not do because of that health, you cannot eat and is not our problem if you starve to death. How about? If anyone curses his father or mother, he must be put to death. If a man lies with a man as one lies with a woman, both of them have done what is detestable. They must be put to death. If a man beats his male or female slave with a rod and the slave dies as a direct result, he must be punished, but he is not to be punished if the slave gets up after a day or two, since the slave is his property. When the Lord your God brings you into the land you are entering to possess and drives out before you many nations then you must destroy them totally. Make no treaty with them, and show them no mercy.

TomTurn -> RE: Socialism should be taught in school at a greater level (5/7/2008 9:34:24 AM)
quote: Yes, they do. TomTurn certainly does. I go by the defintion of the word, not by what I want it to mean. quote: Actually, I made no comment about how grades are viewed. "Grades are a scale of evaluation, a meter to measure scholastic progress". "Grades are not a reward for learning." "we don't "earn" grades." "you don't earn grades any more than you earn your body temperature, bloodpressure, or weight." quote: Grades should accurately reflect their level of understanding no matter what the level. And this is where socialism would come in. It dumbs down the system, which we have seen partly in action through such things as affirmative action. "Mary, you made 100 in everything, yes you can go to Harvard". "Tom you made a 70 in everything, but that was the highest level you could obtain in understanding everything, you can go to Harvard too" quote: The real tragedy is when the system itself reflects human flaws more than human ideals. Again I say that this may very well be why our current system churns out so many dullards with diplomas. And could that be because we have reduced the level of learning to graduate more, making them all equal graduates based on their level of understanding no matter what the level. Or was it better when we were graded on a 1 - 100 scale? Were many of you aware that some schools at graduation are no longer using the term Valedictorian? Schools playing down valedictorian honors quote: Unless, of course, you think like Tom You mean in understanding the meaning of a word and using it correctly in conversation? quote: Maybe this will be true in heaven.......I said that God is fair and impartial, according to the bible. Fairness and impartiality are intrinsic to collectivism, and collectivism is intrinsic to socialism. So, this separates God from socialism by at least two steps. It is true that God loves all of us the same, it is also true that God disciplines in regards to sin in your life in this world. He disciplines the individual, not the collective. quote: Fairness and impartiality are intrinsic to collectivism And I ask again how can collectivism be impartial? To collect you must single out whom to collect from. How is it fair if the one being collected from put in more effort than the one being given what they did not earn? quote: and collectivism is intrinsic to socialism. Which is why it is a failure in the long run. ...... So why is socialism not taught to students more in both action and words? Here in the U.S. once they graduate and move into the working, voting world they will see an increasing drive towards socialism. Why not start the education earlier with the very bascis of socialism. Or is it already being done, hence the need to import foriegn workers from countries where schools that still use the 1 - 100 scale and single out valedictorians? ... Also, If I were in school and were given a test to take but only answered half the questions becasue that is all the effort I wanted to put into it. Which got me a failing grade. Did I earn that grade or was it just an accurate reflection of my level of understanding?

mapachito13 -> RE: Socialism should be taught in school at a greater level (5/7/2008 10:11:16 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: TomTurn quote: Crazy! Sounds like socialism to me! The apostles distributed someone's personal belonging and fortune to all. So they were like a socialistic mini-state. How unfair to the rich guys! So then, is Christian based socialism (as opposed to atheistic socialism) acceptable? Why did you not highlight this part and discuss it and all in context? "The community of believers were of one heart and one mind". Or are you inviting the rest of us to post things out of context also? ok here are some from me, maybe others have some they would like to post "Slaves, submit yourselves to your masters with all respect, not only to those who are good and considerate, but also to those who are harsh". - Guess all that slavery stuff in U.S. history was not such a bad thing and it getting stopped the way it was went against Him "If anyone will not work, neither shall he eat". - There it is, straight from the Bible. If you are in bad health and I offer you a job you will not do because of that health, you cannot eat and is not our problem if you starve to death. How about? If anyone curses his father or mother, he must be put to death. If a man lies with a man as one lies with a woman, both of them have done what is detestable. They must be put to death. If a man beats his male or female slave with a rod and the slave dies as a direct result, he must be punished, but he is not to be punished if the slave gets up after a day or two, since the slave is his property. When the Lord your God brings you into the land you are entering to possess and drives out before you many nations then you must destroy them totally. Make no treaty with them, and show them no mercy. Glad to see you were paying attention. [;)] Too bad we're not of one heart and mind today! And it's no wonder with all the seemingly contradictory statements in the Bible. "But I tell you, that everyone who is angry with his brother without a cause shall be in danger of the judgment;and whoever shall say to his brother,' Raca!' shall be in danger of the council; and whoever shall say,'You fool!' shall be in danger of the fire of Gehenna. If, therefore, you are offering your gift at the altar, and there remember that your brother has anything against you, leave your gift there before the altar, and go your way. First be reconciled to your brother, and then come and offer your gift." Matthew 5:23-24 contradicts the kill the infidel sections of the OT. Why because the heart of the law is justice and mercy. IMHO, unrestrained capitalism (aka greed) can be just as evil as unrestrained socialism. The "free market" can enslave the poor of this world just as much as the state in socialism or the institution of slavery can.

1dblthnk02 -> RE: Socialism should be taught in school at a greater level (5/7/2008 10:17:52 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: TomTurn I go by the defintion of the word, not by what I want it to mean. But you are misapplying it, sir. quote: "Grades are a scale of evaluation, a meter to measure scholastic progress". "Grades are not a reward for learning." "we don't "earn" grades." "you don't earn grades any more than you earn your body temperature, bloodpressure, or weight." These are not views. These are principles. quote: And this is where socialism would come in. It dumbs down the system, which we have seen partly in action through such things as affirmative action. Like I said already, socialist countries don't do this in their schools. quote: "Tom you made a 70 in everything, but that was the highest level you could obtain in understanding everything, you can go to Harvard too" This is exactly what happened with George W. Bush. He got into Harvard because of his father. Talk about "affirmative action" . . . quote: And could that be because we have reduced the level of learning to graduate more, making them all equal graduates based on their level of understanding no matter what the level. We don't do this. Where did you get this idea? quote: Were many of you aware that some schools at graduation are no longer using the term Valedictorian? For the very reason that I have been saying: it is another "reward" system which runs contrary to what education should be about. quote: It is true that God loves all of us the same, it is also true that God disciplines in regards to sin in your life in this world. He disciplines the individual, not the collective. The Fall was a judgement on the collective, not just the individuals responsible for it. quote: And I ask again how can collectivism be impartial? By not distinguishing one from another based on any sort of uniqueness. quote: To collect you must single out whom to collect from. No. When you have a collection, they are all together, not separated out. That is the meaning of the word collective. So much for "understanding the meaning of a word and using it correctly in conversation." quote: How is it fair if the one being collected from put in more effort than the one being given what they did not earn? When fair is used with impartial, it does not mean just. quote: Which is why it is a failure in the long run. Perhaps, but do you have an example? quote: So why is socialism not taught to students more in both action and words? Why isn't American government or American history taught? That's what I want to know. quote: Also, If I were in school and were given a test to take but only answered half the questions becasue that is all the effort I wanted to put into it. Which got me a failing grade. Did I earn that grade or was it just an accurate reflection of my level of understanding? It would be neither. Not trying reflects neither education nor effort.

TomTurn -> RE: Socialism should be taught in school at a greater level (5/7/2008 10:41:03 AM)
quote: So then, is Christian based socialism (as opposed to atheistic socialism) acceptable?......Too bad we're not of one heart and mind today! And it's no wonder with all the seemingly contradictory statements in the Bible. Was in a hurry earlier, anyway The pilgrims tried at the foundation of this country a pure collectivist ideal. And they were rather "Christian based" and of one mind. Did not work out too well. What you quote in Acts but New King James ; "Now the multitude of those who believed were of one heart and one soul; neither did anyone say that any of the things he possessed was his own [it all belongs to God, which is true and we are stewards of it], but they had all things in common". Reads a bit different, hence our need to study and use in context Believers understood that all they had belonged to God, and therfore when a brother or sister had a need those who could meet it were obligated to do so. (james 2:15,16, 1 John 3:17) quote: unrestrained capitalism (aka greed) can be just as evil as unrestrained socialism. The "free market" can enslave the poor of this world just as much as the state in socialism or the institution of slavery can. Well yes but capitalism does not equal greed. As in I like to make more and more through capitalism. The more I make the more I can give. Is that greed?

rhippie -> RE: Socialism should be taught in school at a greater level (5/7/2008 11:04:52 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: 1dblthnk02 However, I don't see what this actually has to do with socialism, which is chiefly an ideology seeking to place workers in ownership of production rather than corporations. We see this happen in our society all the time, btw. I remember when a local grocery chain became "employee-owned." Of course, this was mainly a facade; the "employees" really amounted to a corporation of their own union . . . Based upon this comment I would suggest you go back school and take some basic business and economic courses because it is patently obvious that you do not understand who owns corporations. What's that you say? You took business and economics in college? Then I would suggest that you sue the professor for having failed at his/her job which is to educate people about such things!!

1dblthnk02 -> RE: Socialism should be taught in school at a greater level (5/8/2008 9:30:42 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: rhippie Based upon this comment I would suggest you go back school and take some basic business and economic courses because it is patently obvious that you do not understand who owns corporations. Based on the obvious lack of maturity in your posts, I suggest that you go to school in the first place. quote: What's that you say? You took business and economics in college? Then I would suggest that you sue the professor for having failed at his/her job which is to educate people about such things!! Nah. I wouldn't take business or economics. Those guys were crackpots!

1dblthnk02 -> RE: Socialism should be taught in school at a greater level (5/8/2008 11:19:51 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: radiorobert Perhaps in time, the holy spirit will work in your heart to draw you to Christ. I will pray for you. I appreciate the sentiment very much. However, I've already been there and done that.

mcp -> RE: Socialism should be taught in school at a greater level (5/8/2008 1:45:05 PM)
quote: IMHO, unrestrained capitalism (aka greed) can be just as evil as unrestrained socialism. The "free market" can enslave the poor of this world just as much as the state in socialism or the institution of slavery can. Of course, this is true. The differences, however, capitalism provides (in theory) one degree of separation between the ruling/military class and private equity. In socialism the government is also more synonymous with big business than in capitalism. If the gov't just acts as a regulator of business, instead of the competition or owner, then you have the best system we have come up with. It's like our justice system- many flaws- but it is near the best that we can get at this point. Last point is that the slaves in a capitalist system can experience the benefits of being considered an asset; whereas, the government has no considerable investment in their 'slaves'. Also, since capitalism enables productivity, generally the poor fair better than in a full socialist program (where only an oligarchy has the high life); everyone else may be third-world poor (considering comforts, food quality, health, money-on-hand, etc). Imagine our cattle can get more access to healthcare (even if just a generic pill) than some countries have. Yes, a corrupt free market system could reject a poor person from entering the corner store to spend their dollar; that is where we hope that gov't's weigh in correctly in regulating the rights of the individual.

relady -> RE: Socialism should be taught in school at a greater level (5/8/2008 4:28:51 PM)
quote: To collect you would have to be taking from someone who had something to collect from, to give to another. How is that impartial or even fair? Because theoretically all would not only be giving but would also be receiving. If something you had excess of was taken from you, then something you needed would be given to you. That's the THEORY. Unfortunately, it doesn't work except in very small enclaves. However, it doesn't mean the theory is bad and all aspects of it should be scrapped. In fact, if it could be put into practice the way it's theoretically intended, the world would be a much better place for everyone, not just the fortunate few. quote: This is exactly what happened with George W. Bush. He got into Harvard because of his father. Talk about "affirmative action" . . . LOL, yeah. George "I was a C student and proud of it" got into Yale. He certainly didn't get in because of his grades, he got in because of who his dad was and his daddy's money. Yeah, that's fair.

mcp -> RE: Socialism should be taught in school at a greater level (5/8/2008 4:51:19 PM)
quote: Because theoretically all would not only be giving but would also be receiving. If something you had excess of was taken from you, then something you needed would be given to you. That's the THEORY. Unfortunately, it doesn't work except in very small enclaves. However, it doesn't mean the theory is bad and all aspects of it should be scrapped. In fact, if it could be put into practice the way it's theoretically intended, the world would be a much better place for everyone, not just the fortunate few. But it can't effectively be put into practice. In most considerations, one class wouldn't be in need to receive much of anything, but would give significantly under point of the sword. Maybe, they had a better ministry or concern to donate to; but someone has a better idea for their assets. That someone is what concerns me; especially as we go global. You also forget that there has to be a facilitator of this redistribution; therein lies your new privileged class.

upNORTder -> RE: Socialism should be taught in school at a greater level (5/9/2008 1:53:56 AM)
quote: Well yes but capitalism does not equal greed. As in I like to make more and more through capitalism. The more I make the more I can give. Is that greed? Not if you give all of it.

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