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ORIGINAL: Jhud

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Yes, of course I am. He was a person created in God's image and dearly loved by God. Are you suggesting that God loves you more than that man? Are you presuming to be the judge of this man's heart? Do you know anything about this man in whose death you take such delight? You assume this man is destined for hell and then say that it is cause for celebration. It is one thing to judge this man's actions as evil and another thing entirely for you to presume to judge his soul. If you are going to say you haven't judged him, then ask yourself why you rejoice at his death?

I am not suggesting that God loves me more than that man; but I am suggesting that if I did what that man did, then ultimately the legitimate authority that God has given earthly governments to punish evil actions would be applied to me as well.

I am not required to know the man's 'heart' to agree that his actions required a just response by the appropriate governing authorities.

I am not celebrating his eternal punishment, but the end of his earthly reign of terror against innocents.

It's really not a matter of judging his heart (as I didn't obviously know him personally) as it is judging the actions of an organization that is wholly evil in it's intents and methods.

So I rejoice in none of these things, but the fact that this evil organization is today short one member, and hopefully tommorrow, many, many more.

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ORIGINAL: SovereignIsHe

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ORIGINAL: Jhud

I am not required to know the man's 'heart' to agree that his actions required a just response by the appropriate governing authorities.

How does a just response include killing people that the appropriate governing authorities have no lawful reason to kill?

John

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ORIGINAL: kernsfamily

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ORIGINAL: SovereignIsHe

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ORIGINAL: Jhud

I am not required to know the man's 'heart' to agree that his actions required a just response by the appropriate governing authorities.

How does a just response include killing people that the appropriate governing authorities have no lawful reason to kill?

John

an issue that's been around since the beginning of time, when "at war" with the enemy....the U.S. leveled entire cities in Europe, used the A-Bomb on Nagasaki and Hiroshima, bombed cities in Japan (in retaliation right after Pearl Harbor)....and, all that's JUST a few instances during WWII....

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If the cops acted in this manner they could face charges and for sure would not be cops anymore... And if one were to kill 12 other people in the act of defending themselves they would go to jail...

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Here's a verse that I think applies well in this case ...

Matthew 5:43-47 "You have heard that it was said, 'Love your neighbor and hate your enemy.' 44But I tell you: Love your enemies and pray for those who persecute you, 45that you may be sons of your Father in heaven. He causes his sun to rise on the evil and the good, and sends rain on the righteous and the unrighteous. 46If you love those who love you, what reward will you get? Are not even the tax collectors doing that? 47And if you greet only your brothers, what are you doing more than others? Do not even pagans do that?"

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ORIGINAL: Jhud

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If the cops acted in this manner they could face charges and for sure would not be cops anymore... And if one were to kill 12 other people in the act of defending themselves they would go to jail...

Yes, and if the cops hauled someone off without reading them their rights and having the opportunity to have a lawyer present they would be in trouble as well; but that is why we don't apply those rules to wartime actions.

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ORIGINAL: Jhud

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Here's a verse that I think applies well in this case ...

Matthew 5:43-47 "You have heard that it was said, 'Love your neighbor and hate your enemy.' 44But I tell you: Love your enemies and pray for those who persecute you, 45that you may be sons of your Father in heaven. He causes his sun to rise on the evil and the good, and sends rain on the righteous and the unrighteous. 46If you love those who love you, what reward will you get? Are not even the tax collectors doing that? 47And if you greet only your brothers, what are you doing more than others? Do not even pagans do that?"

You cannot apply that to the action of a government; indeed, not only is it it is absurd to do so, but a government that did so would be acting contrary to God's plan for government.

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I'm sorry, did I miss something? Is the U.S. at war with Somalia?

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I wasn't meaning it to apply to the government, I was speaking to you personally regarding your feelings about the death of someone you consider your enemy.

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ORIGINAL: Jhud

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I'm sorry, did I miss something? Is the U.S. at war with Somalia?

Yeah, apparently you did miss something; we are at war with Al Queda.

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ORIGINAL: Jhud

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I wasn't meaning it to apply to the government, I was speaking to you personally regarding your feelings about the death of someone you consider your enemy.

Well, I haven't killed any enemies lately, so apparently I am in compliance.

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Wow ... that's convenient. Al Qaeda huh? So wherever we find an Al Qaeda member we can go enter that country and kill people? What if you find one in downtown L.A. - will it be okay to kill a dozen bystanders in order to get him? You might as well say we are at war with evil - which gives us the right to kill anyone anywhere whom we deem evil.

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ORIGINAL: Jhud

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Wow ... that's convenient. Al Qaeda huh? So wherever we find an Al Qaeda member we can go enter that country and kill people? What if you find one in downtown L.A. - will it be okay to kill a dozen bystanders in order to get him? You might as well say we are at war with evil - which gives us the right to kill anyone anywhere whom we deem evil.

Do you have any reason to believe we didn't communicate with the appropriate authorities in Somalia?

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You have to be joking, right? You cannot seriously be in that much denial. Do you really believe that anyone said you killed anyone, or is this simply the ridiculous red herring it appears to be?

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I asked if we were at war with Somalia to which you replied that I missed the memo "we are at war with Al Qaeda". Is Somalia synonymous with Al Qaeda or did they cooperate with the air strike? You can't have it both ways.

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ORIGINAL: Jhud

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I asked if we were at war with Somalia to which you replied that I missed the memo "we are at war with Al Qaeda". Is Somalia synonymous with Al Qaeda or did they cooperate with the air strike? You can't have it both ways.

Somalia is a basket case. We are at war with Al Queda. It was totally appropriate to strike them where they are rebuilding.

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ORIGINAL: Jhud

Then what in the world are you talking about? I don't need to 'forgive' him because I didn't hold anything against him. I couldn't love him because until I heard about his untimely death, I didn't know about him. He wasn't persecuting me; his organization attacked my country and the appropriate and Godly response was given by the appropriate authorities. What you are talking about has nothing to do with the situation at hand.

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There is never anything sad about a dead Al Queda leader.

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there is certianly no reason for us not to be glad it happened.

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The death of civilians is sad; the death of Al Queda leaders is not.

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We could do I suppose much as we have done in Darfur, which is watch hundreds of thousands of innocents die all the while wringing our hands over it, or we could kill the people perpetuating such genocides. I prefer the latter.

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are you saying that an Al Queda leader is a child of God?

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ORIGINAL: Jhud

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If the cops acted in this manner they could face charges and for sure would not be cops anymore... And if one were to kill 12 other people in the act of defending themselves they would go to jail...

Yes, and if the cops hauled someone off without reading them their rights and having the opportunity to have a lawyer present they would be in trouble as well; but that is why we don't apply those rules to wartime actions.

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ORIGINAL: Jhud

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I'm sorry, did I miss something? Is the U.S. at war with Somalia?

Yeah, apparently you did miss something; we are at war with Al Queda.

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ORIGINAL: SovereignIsHe

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ORIGINAL: Jhud

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If the cops acted in this manner they could face charges and for sure would not be cops anymore... And if one were to kill 12 other people in the act of defending themselves they would go to jail...

Yes, and if the cops hauled someone off without reading them their rights and having the opportunity to have a lawyer present they would be in trouble as well; but that is why we don't apply those rules to wartime actions.

We are not talking about forgetting to read someone their rights, but the killing of 12 people in order to get one bad guy... What grants the military the right to do so?

John

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So what is the allowable number of non-combatant that can be killed? 12 to 1 is a pretty nasty ratio...

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ORIGINAL: SovereignIsHe

We are not talking about forgetting to read someone their rights, but the killing of 12 people in order to get one bad guy... What grants the military the right to do so?

John

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We are not talking about forgetting to read someone their rights, but the killing of 12 people in order to get one bad guy... What grants the military the right to do so?

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So what is the allowable number of non-combatant that can be killed? 12 to 1 is a pretty nasty ratio...

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So Somalia is a basket case or we're at war with them?

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Seems like you presume to know plenty about him and that perhaps you do hold something against him.