RE: Be Holy? (Full Version)

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drmark -> RE: Be Holy? (5/14/2008 12:42:29 PM)

quote:

And, Mark, I don't know how I can be more clear either. I have presented Scripture after Scripture. I am sorry beyond measure that we write but do not actually communicate with one another.
It seems our discussion is getting beyond the bounds of the OP but I still firmly believe it is directly related to Holiness doctrine and the Biblical command to "be holy". In the interest of clarity and to allow more participation, I plan to start a new thread in the Christian Doctrine forum on "Unintentional Sins - How Are They Forgiven?"

quote:

Where, in the Torah (or Law) do you find "Jesus' "summation" (your word, not mine) of all the Law and Prophets"? Can you give me chapter and verse? Do you believe that these "two" are enough, so the rest of the books in the Bible before Matthew are unnecessary or not relevant to today?
Well, I'm sure you read the following post from the Jeremiah 31/Hebrews 10 thread by Bluethread:
quote:

Good, so we are in agreement that Adonai will write Deut 6:5 and Lev 19:18 on our hearts, since these are the passages Yeshua (Jesus) is quoting as a summary of Ha Torah (The Word) in Matthew 22:37-40.
Actually, the Greek word in Matt 22:40 which you and Bluethread are translating "sum up or summarize" is kremannumi, meaning hang up, suspend from, or depend on. To me, that does not imply that Christians should view the Law as "unnecessary or irrelevant", but rather that when we love G-d with all our being and others as ourselves we are fully obeying the intent and purpose of the Law. This also defines holiness - short, sweet, and to the point! Does that make sense to you?

quote:

What happened to the souls of the fathers I mentioned in my list go, since they apparently had no salvation through Messiah? If you believe they were saved, how did they acquire salvation? If they were not saved, did they all go to hell? If they did not go to hell, where are they?
Abiyah, please don't put words in my mouth. The fathers were saved by grace just as we are! The mechanism or basis of efficacy for that grace must of necessity be different pre-Atonement versus post-Atonement. Unless you believe the Atonement occurred before creation - that makes no sense at all to me!

quote:

And, since you brought it up, the idea that He died on Friday night: Did He?
Actually, you brought it up by referencing the "Lamb slain before the foundation of the world". I think there are other threads for this topic!



Covaan_Meshuga -> RE: Be Holy? (5/14/2008 2:30:32 PM)

Mark, this is like trying to dance with a squirrel. Ha-ha-ha! I'll get back to you later, when I am on break.



Bluethread -> RE: Be Holy? (5/14/2008 4:34:47 PM)

drmark:

quote:

quote:

Good, so we are in agreement that Adonai will write Deut 6:5 and Lev 19:18 on our hearts, since these are the passages Yeshua (Jesus) is quoting as a summary of Ha Torah (The Word) in Matthew 22:37-40.


Actually, the Greek word in Matt 22:40 which you and Bluethread are translating "sum up or summarize" is kremannumi, meaning hang up, suspend from, or depend on. To me, that does not imply that Christians should view the Law as "unnecessary or irrelevant", but rather that when we love G-d with all our being and others as ourselves we are fully obeying the intent and purpose of the Law. This also defines holiness - short, sweet, and to the point! Does that make sense to you?


I am honored that you see value in quoting me! However, as I pointed out in the other thread, many of us are yet to fully realize what it means to love Adonai with all our hearts, and souls and strength and our neighbor as ourselves. Therefore, what are we who are less holy supposed to do to be holy? Though I believe holy and righteous are two different things, for the sake of this line of argument I will accept them as the same.



Bluethread -> RE: Be Holy? (5/14/2008 4:59:42 PM)

drmark:

quote:

The fathers were saved by grace just as we are! The mechanism or basis of efficacy for that grace must of necessity be different pre-Atonement versus post-Atonement. Unless you believe the Atonement occurred before creation - that makes no sense at all to me!


What you propose is only necessary if we accept liniar time as yet another essential doctrine. The idea of liniar time is a western concept and is tied up in the philosophies of progress and evolution. Eastern philosophy, into which the Scriptures were placed, is more circular. Now, I am not saying that either philosophy is correct, I just don't think Adonai has to act in a liniar fashion.

Re 13:8
All inhabitants of the earth will worship the beast--all whose names have not been written in the book of life belonging to the Lamb that was slain from the creation of the world.

This seems to reinforce Pauls view that, Those He foreknew, He also predesdined to be conformed to His image. If this is yet another example of hyperbole, then on what basis did Paul say that Abraham's faith was counted as righteousness.

Now, there are several concepts and "essential doctrines" that are in play here which can cause a lot of confusion. I think the crux of the difficulty is in the difference between the Greek and Hebrew mindsets. As you say this is beyond the scope of this thread. That said , if we focus on one point at a time and make sure we agree before moving on to the next point, we might be able to make progress without going off topic.



drmark -> RE: Be Holy? (5/14/2008 5:01:57 PM)

quote:

Therefore, what are we who are less holy supposed to do to be holy?
Ahh, Bluethread, the easiest question of the whole discussion! We are not supposed to do anything - Adonai makes us holy, by the grace of God and the power of the Holy Spirit.
1 Thess 5:23-25 - May God himself, the God of peace, sanctify you through and through. May your whole spirit, soul and body be kept blameless at the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ. The one who calls you is faithful and he will do it. Brothers, pray for us.

Brother, I will pray for you!



Bluethread -> RE: Be Holy? (5/14/2008 6:12:55 PM)

quote:

drmark:

quote:

Therefore, what are we who are less holy supposed to do to be holy?


Ahh, Bluethread, the easiest question of the whole discussion! We are not supposed to do anything - Adonai makes us holy, by the grace of God and the power of the Holy Spirit.

1 Thess 5:23-25 - May God himself, the God of peace, sanctify you through and through. May your whole spirit, soul and body be kept blameless at the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ. The one who calls you is faithful and he will do it. Brothers, pray for us.


So, I will ask you, how do you know what to do? Do you get direct revelation? You appear to be familiar with Paul's teachings. Did you study these and when, before your being made holy or after?

Most important to this thread, why did Peter tell us to be holy, if we are that way anyway?

Peter 1:15-16 Peter writes: 15 But just as he who called you is holy, so be holy in all you do; 16 for it is written: “Be holy, because I am holy.”



Covaan_Meshuga -> RE: Be Holy? (5/14/2008 7:49:09 PM)

Well, Mark, at this time -- for now -- I am not taking this any further. It is starting to feel like it is harrassment toward you, and I'm just not into that. We have had a long, friendly relationship, and I am not going to jeopardize that by coming off, in your mind, as harrassing you.

Perhaps we'll take this up at another time. [sm=icon_smile.gif]



drmark -> RE: Be Holy? (5/14/2008 11:23:20 PM)

quote:

So, I will ask you, how do you know what to do? Do you get direct revelation? You appear to be familiar with Paul's teachings. Did you study these and when, before your being made holy or after?
My goodness, so many questions, so little time. Seriously, if you are asking how one develops one's doctrinal understandings, that would take up an entire discussion thread! I will just briefly summarize the Wesleyan method of doctrinal understanding which you can read about in more detail HERE IF YOU WISH.

Sound theology must start with Scriptural truth, but it is also shaped by long-standing tradition, rational reasoning, and personal experience. The Wesleyan/Holiness doctrine of entire sanctification fully meets all these methods. It is NOT the only doctrine correctly explaining the what, how, and why of "being holy". I just know (assurance of the Holy Spirit) that it works for me and millions of other Believers around the world.

quote:

Most important to this thread, why did Peter tell us to be holy, if we are that way anyway?
I'm sorry, I don't follow you here. Who is Peter saying is holy anyway and when did this holiness occur?



Bluethread -> RE: Be Holy? (5/15/2008 2:18:51 PM)

quote:

drmark:
quote:

Most important to this thread, why did Peter tell us to be holy, if we are that way anyway?


I'm sorry, I don't follow you here. Who is Peter saying is holy anyway and when did this holiness occur?


That is my point. I don't think Peter is saying we are holy. It sounds to me that you are saying that we will be made holy regardless of what we do. So, why do anything and why would Peter tell us to do what will happen without our even trying?

quote:

Ahh, Bluethread, the easiest question of the whole discussion! We are not supposed to do anything - Adonai makes us holy, by the grace of God and the power of the Holy Spirit.



gmc4Jesus -> RE: Be Holy? (5/15/2008 8:38:52 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: drmark
quote:

Therefore, what are we who are less holy supposed to do to be holy?


Ahh, Bluethread, the easiest question of the whole discussion! We are not supposed to do anything - Adonai makes us holy, by the grace of God and the power of the Holy Spirit.
1 Thess 5:23-25 - May God himself, the God of peace, sanctify you through and through. May your whole spirit, soul and body be kept blameless at the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ. The one who calls you is faithful and he will do it. Brothers, pray for us.

Brother, I will pray for you!


This is an interesting part about being holy.

First, we must acknowledge that being set apart is something God does to us when we accept Jesus as our Lord and Svaior. The moment we become Christians, God imparts His Spirit into us and we are declared holy whether we are acting like saints or not.

Second, we are not without obligation or responsibility in this matter. If God says we are holy, we need to live up to His expectations. Afterall, God never expects anything of us that we can't do. Therefore, it is imperative that we learn to recognize the temptations that lead us to sin and eliminate those temptations or change how we respond to them so we will not sin.

As we take conscious steps to eliminate sin from our lives, we mature to a level of holiness. While it is still not perfect, we develop a level of spiritual maturity that assists us in being role models of Christ-likeness to others.

I want to be more like Jesus. God bless you as you do your part on becoming more like Him also.



LBolt -> RE: Be Holy? (5/16/2008 11:44:53 AM)

This is a good post GMC, I deal with this a bit in the Law thread. Peter told us to be holy because God is Holy. The question is what is the Biblical definition of sin? How do I know what sin is? If I am a sinner, something must have been a righteous standard, morally for me to see the error of my ways. The answer is in I John 3:4-5.

Peter quoted Leviticus, that same book which is supposed to inferior to the NT! I agree when we accept Christ we are declared righteous and holy. As you read His word, from Genesis-Revelation we find out His righteousness and His divine standards and instructions. As we practice those things we start to be more like Him.



Heavendweller -> RE: Be Holy? (5/16/2008 1:43:13 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: gmc4Jesus

This is an interesting part about being holy.

First, we must acknowledge that being set apart is something God does to us when we accept Jesus as our Lord and Savior. The moment we become Christians, God imparts His Spirit into us and we are declared holy whether we are acting like saints or not.

gmc, This is a very good point you make. In the initial act of regeneration, God calls us out of the world to make us holy. Thus it is that we are joined to the body of Christ, a holy nation of believers. But this is not the end of the journey, but only the beginning. We are to be worthy of the calling to which He has called us.

Act 26:20, "and also to the Gentiles, that they should repent and turn to God and perform deeds worthy of their repentance."

Ephesians 4:1, "I therefore, a prisoner for the Lord, beg you to lead a life worthy of the calling to which you have been called, with all lowliness and meekness, with patience, forbearing one another in love, eager to maintain the unity of the Spirit in the bond of peace."

Philippians 1:27, "Only let your manner of life be worthy of the gospel of Christ, so that whether I com and see you or am absent, I may hear of you that you stand firm in one spirit, with one mind striving side by side for the faith of the gospel."

Colossians 1:9-10, "And so, from the day we heard of it, we have not ceased to pray for you, asking that you may be filled with the knowledge of his will in all spiritual wisdom and understanding, to lead a life worthy of the Lord, fully pleasing to him, bearing fruit in every good work and increasing in the knowledge of God."

I Thess. 2:12, "for you know how, like a father with his children, we exhorted each one of you and encouraged you and charged you to lead a life worthy of God, who calls you into his own kingdom and glory."

quote:

Second, we are not without obligation or responsibility in this matter. If God says we are holy, we need to live up to His expectations. Afterall, God never expects anything of us that we can't do. Therefore, it is imperative that we learn to recognize the temptations that lead us to sin and eliminate those temptations or change how we respond to them so we will not sin.

And this is where the debate ensues, gm. Some say there is no obligation or responsibility on our part. Some reckon that their responsibility and obligation to live a holy life is not incumbent upon them. They believe that when they were initially regenerated, that all their responsiblity and obligation was laid upon Christ. Therefore, there is nothing they can do or will do to live a holy life. This view fails to recognize that our Christian life is one of submission. That we are still called to put into action principles of holy living which are given to us in Scripture.

The nature of Christian living takes two, the Lord Jesus and me. He has empowered me by the indwelling Holy Spirit, so that it is not my actions apart from Him but my actions in union with Him that are pleasing to Him. He grants us to be partakers of His divine nature and His will is to change us into His likeness. But being changed into His likeness from one degree of glory to another cannot happen without my will being subject to His will. I must submit to and obey Him (which I could not do prior to being a Christian), and as I do, He santifies me, and changes me.

The Christian life is not stagnant but growing. The Christian should be able to look back on their life and see stages of growth and victory. One cannot live on the initial occurance of regeneration and think that is enough. We are called to be overcomers, victorious in our struggles against the flesh, and we are equipped to be victorious as can be seen in Ephesian 6, where we are given all the necessary tools to live the Christian life.

quote:

As we take conscious steps to eliminate sin from our lives, we mature to a level of holiness. While it is still not perfect, we develop a level of spiritual maturity that assists us in being role models of Christ-likeness to others.

And we are able to live holy lives through the imparted grace which Christ our Lord gives to us. I think the whole idea of theosis is missed among many Christians. Christ became man (incarnated) in order that we could have His infused life abiding within us so that we could become Christ-like. This is the witness to the world that Christians possess a life which is other-worldly and manifests itself in charity, patience, kindness, long-suffering, self-control, gentleness, peace, joy, etc. It is this infused life of the Holy Spirit within the believer that is meant to draw others to Christ.

quote:

I want to be more like Jesus. God bless you as you do your part on becoming more like Him also.

Amen! We should always desire to reflect our Lord in all that we do, all that we say, even our very thoughts.

God bless you on your journey!

Heavendweller



drmark -> RE: Be Holy? (5/16/2008 3:09:47 PM)

quote:

The moment we become Christians, God imparts His Spirit into us and we are declared holy whether we are acting like saints or not.
Agreed gmc, this is imputed righteousness.

quote:

If God says we are holy, we need to live up to His expectations. Afterall, God never expects anything of us that we can't do.
Agreed gmc, this is imparted righteousness.

quote:

And we are able to live holy lives through the imparted grace which Christ our Lord gives to us. I think the whole idea of theosis is missed among many Christians.
And this is why we are having this discussion, Heavendweller, because too many Christians stop at imputed righteousness and fail to appropriate their imparted righteousness. Ya can't have one without the other! Nor can we have a standing in Christ that is not commensurate to our state with Christ. We are saved in our sins and from our sin or we are not saved at all.

quote:

Christ became man (incarnated) in order that we could have His infused life abiding within us so that we could become Christ-like. This is the witness to the world that Christians possess a life which is other-worldly and manifests itself in charity, patience, kindness, long-suffering, self-control, gentleness, peace, joy, etc. It is this infused life of the Holy Spirit within the believer that is meant to draw others to Christ.
The concept of infused righteousness is the Roman Catholic mechanism of justification by the sacraments of baptism and penance. It is considered borderline heresy by most Protestant theologians (including Wesleyan/Holiness adherents) because of the claim of works-based justification. I feel it is confusing at best to mention the term "infused life" in a holiness discussion (just my personal opinion).



Heavendweller -> RE: Be Holy? (5/16/2008 3:29:22 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: drmark
quote:

Christ became man (incarnated) in order that we could have His infused life abiding within us so that we could become Christ-like. This is the witness to the world that Christians possess a life which is other-worldly and manifests itself in charity, patience, kindness, long-suffering, self-control, gentleness, peace, joy, etc. It is this infused life of the Holy Spirit within the believer that is meant to draw others to Christ.
The concept of infused righteousness is the Roman Catholic mechanism of justification by the sacraments of baptism and penance. It is considered borderline heresy by most Protestant theologians (including Wesleyan/Holiness adherents) because of the claim of works-based justification. I feel it is confusing at best to mention the term "infused life" in a holiness discussion (just my personal opinion).

drmark, I understand your concern here. But I am not trying to represent the Roman Catholic paradigm. I think Scripture shows that the believer in Christ is actually imbued with a grace which occurs at regeneration, and this grace is what enables the Christian to actually live by faith. I stress the word ACTUALLY because the understanding within many Christian circles is that the imputed righteousness of Christ exempts the Christian from this process. Those holding to this version of "imputed righteousness" think that Christ did it all for them at Calvary so that they don't have to live responsibly. Thus it is that we see such slogans on car bumpers as "I'm not perfect, just forgiven," which appeals to the lowest common denominator.

Hope you understand what I meant. I realized that using the term "infused" might be a bit controversial. Hope I cleared up the misunderstanding. If not, you can freely respond.

God bless you,
Heavendweller



drmark -> RE: Be Holy? (5/16/2008 3:46:43 PM)

quote:

I think Scripture shows that the believer in Christ is actually imbued with a grace which occurs at regeneration, and this grace is what enables the Christian to actually live by faith.
Then why should we not call this the grace of imparted righteousness? What little I've read of infused righteousness implies that God instills the very holiness of Christ's divinity into those who maintain their righteousness by ongoing good works. This is NOT the Wesleyan understanding of imparted righteousness whereby we receive the godly nature of holiness (2 Peter 1:4) in order to replace the old sinful self with Christlike power for holy living (Eph 4:24).



Heavendweller -> RE: Be Holy? (5/16/2008 4:14:43 PM)

quote:

quote:

ORIGINAL: drmark

quote:

I think Scripture shows that the believer in Christ is actually imbued with a grace which occurs at regeneration, and this grace is what enables the Christian to actually live by faith.
Then why should we not call this the grace of imparted righteousness? What little I've read of infused righteousness implies that God instills the very holiness of Christ's divinity into those who maintain their righteousness by ongoing good works. This is NOT the Wesleyan understanding of imparted righteousness whereby we receive the godly nature of holiness (2 Peter 1:4) in order to replace the old sinful self with Christlike power for holy living (Eph 4:24).

Hey doc,
I think it's a matter of semantics. I'm not quite understanding your point above. As per what I have bolded, I can't quite get my brain around what you are saying.
The point I am trying to stress is that we who have been given the gift of the Holy Spirit are also given the grace by that same Spirit to put to death the deeds of the flesh and live holy, upright and godly lives NOW. No such thing as Him doing it for us, while we continue living in the flesh.

I think this is the whole idea of becoming Christ-like. If we claim we are followers of Christ, do we not have to actually follow Him and imitate Him?

drmark, I admit I don't understand the nuances of these two particular beliefs and the detrimental outcome if one adheres to the "infused" paradigm. Perhaps you could elaborate a bit?

I do think though, that sometimes we have "buttons" pushed within us that make us reactionary. Having been in a works-related cult, there are certain phrases/terms of which I can immediately react to in a negative fashion. That's just because of my horrible experience there rather than the term itself being wrong. My husband has negative reactions toward the word "liturgy" but that's mostly because he was raised in the high-Anglican Church, not because liturgical worship is bad. Understand my point here?

Take care.

Heavendweller



drmark -> RE: Be Holy? (5/16/2008 4:32:29 PM)

quote:

I think it's a matter of semantics. I'm not quite understanding your point above. As per what I have bolded, I can't quite get my brain around what you are saying.
Yes, it is a matter of semantics but the history of these terms has major consequences for theological doctrine. As best I can say, infused righteousness is based on one's ongoing obedience to do good works while imparted righteousness is based on God's grace and the Holy Spirit's power to enable one to do good works.

quote:

I think this is the whole idea of becoming Christ-like. If we claim we are followers of Christ, do we not have to actually follow Him and imitate Him?
Absolutely correct! The command is to be holy, not wish it, not pretend or appear it, not let Christ do it all for you while you sin away, not try harder next time...

quote:

drmark, I admit I don't understand the nuances of these two particular beliefs and the detrimental outcome if one adheres to the "infused" paradigm. Perhaps you could elaborate a bit?
Only what I posted in the first paragraph. Perhaps you can read some RCC doctrinal statements if you wish to know more.

quote:

Understand my point here?
Sure, personal experiences are a very important part of forming a coherent understanding of Christian doctrine. If it's not working for you, it may need re-evaluation and revision. From the number of folks I see admitting to daily sinning, their understanding of holiness is NOT working!



gmc4Jesus -> RE: Be Holy? (5/19/2008 12:24:02 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Heavendweller

But this is not the end of the journey, but only the beginning. We are to be worthy of the calling to which He has called us.

Act 26:20, "and also to the Gentiles, that they should repent and turn to God and perform deeds worthy of their repentance."

Ephesians 4:1, "I therefore, a prisoner for the Lord, beg you to lead a life worthy of the calling to which you have been called, with all lowliness and meekness, with patience, forbearing one another in love, eager to maintain the unity of the Spirit in the bond of peace."

Philippians 1:27, "Only let your manner of life be worthy of the gospel of Christ, so that whether I com and see you or am absent, I may hear of you that you stand firm in one spirit, with one mind striving side by side for the faith of the gospel."

Colossians 1:9-10, "And so, from the day we heard of it, we have not ceased to pray for you, asking that you may be filled with the knowledge of his will in all spiritual wisdom and understanding, to lead a life worthy of the Lord, fully pleasing to him, bearing fruit in every good work and increasing in the knowledge of God."

I Thess. 2:12, "for you know how, like a father with his children, we exhorted each one of you and encouraged you and charged you to lead a life worthy of God, who calls you into his own kingdom and glory."

The Christian life is not stagnant but growing. The Christian should be able to look back on their life and see stages of growth and victory. One cannot live on the initial occurance of regeneration and think that is enough. We are called to be overcomers, victorious in our struggles against the flesh, and we are equipped to be victorious as can be seen in Ephesian 6, where we are given all the necessary tools to live the Christian life.

quote:

I want to be more like Jesus. God bless you as you do your part on becoming more like Him also.

Amen! We should always desire to reflect our Lord in all that we do, all that we say, even our very thoughts.

God bless you on your journey!

Heavendweller


There has been some great discussion going on hear. We are recognizing that being holy does require some effort on our part. It is hardly a "work" as some would try to imply because it does not earn anything. It is simply actions that backup what Christ has done in our lives.

Like many other Christians, I love God, Jesus and the Holy Spirit so much that I want to do things that please Him. I'm not earning anything, but serving out of love. This change of behavior causes more Christians to become more holy in their daily living. They don't get holy by doing these works. God already took care of that. They do exhibit the holiness in their behavior as they refrain from their old sinful behaviors and replace them with God-honoring behaviors.

Our challenge is to focus on how much we love Jesus because He first loved us. That will motivate us to want to do that which pleases Him. In so doing, we will become more holy, set apart from the sinful world, than we were before Christ.

Keep doing it for Jesus! It's all about Him!



Bluethread -> RE: Be Holy? (5/19/2008 4:57:50 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: drmark

Sure, personal experiences are a very important part of forming a coherent understanding of Christian doctrine. If it's not working for you, it may need re-evaluation and revision. From the number of folks I see admitting to daily sinning, their understanding of holiness is NOT working!


So, how long has it been since you committed a sin? No details are necessary.



drmark -> RE: Be Holy? (5/19/2008 5:02:15 PM)

quote:

So, how long has it been since you committed a sin? No details are necessary.
Would it be a sin to tell you that I've not sinned yet today?



Bluethread -> RE: Be Holy? (5/19/2008 5:03:33 PM)

That still doesn't answer the question?



drmark -> RE: Be Holy? (5/19/2008 5:13:48 PM)

Actually, it does, if you think about it. [;)]



Bluethread -> RE: Be Holy? (5/19/2008 5:22:24 PM)

By your defintion, when was the last time you committed a sin? I'm not going to provide you with a defintion of sin just so you can reject it. Since you understand this holiness concept, you have to be the one to explain it to the rest of us.



drmark -> RE: Be Holy? (5/19/2008 7:03:41 PM)

quote:

By your defintion, when was the last time you committed a sin?
I'm sorry, Bluethread, but I cannot truthfully answer your question so it would be deliberate disobedience to a known law of God for me to fabricate any other response. I think I know you well enough to say you do not want me to sin for the sake of your curiosity. Since God has removed my past sins as far as the east is from the west and His love and righteousness is with me (Psalm 103:6-18), why should I keep a log book of my sins? Do you do this?

What I can truthfully say (and have posted numerous times on various threads) is the following: God has gloriously cleansed me of my sinful nature in the past. I am not sinning at this moment and I do not intend to sin in the next moment. Thus, I am holy at this moment, by the grace of God and the power of the Holy Spirit.

quote:

Since you understand this holiness concept, you have to be the one to explain it to the rest of us.
Actually, the Holy Spirit through personal prayer and meditation, the application of God's Word, and daily examples of Holiness Believers would all be much better at bringing understanding than my limited efforts on an electronic discussion board! I have never met a single soul whom God refused to make holy and righteous when they earnestly and humbly sought His sanctifying grace in their life. The first step is full consecration, not intellectual understanding.



gmc4Jesus -> RE: Be Holy? (5/22/2008 11:37:19 PM)

I find that as we mature as Christians, we become more aware of the sins that we commit. I'll reference Romans 6 where Paul reminds us that we are freed from the bondage of sin and should not live in it any longer. That being the case, we should mature to the point that we do not sin everyday.

If we are still sinning everyday, then either we haven't matured in our walk with Jesus or we are applying a very loose definition of sin that I think negates what Jesus taught.

God, please make me aware of temptation so I can refrain from sinning!



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