RE: a word from a Prophet/Prophetess (Full Version)

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SonInMe1 -> RE: a word from a Prophet/Prophetess (5/17/2008 5:24:35 PM)

So, when your pewmate says to you...God told me you are gonna play for the Giants next year and win another Super Bowl....it better happen or your pewmate is a liar, fraud and probably not saved.



oldmethuselah -> RE: a word from a Prophet/Prophetess (5/17/2008 9:38:51 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Kath

quote:

ORIGINAL: SonInMe1

Thing is...a prophet is NEVER wrong. 100%


Exactly. Otherwise they are no better than Jeanne Dixon and all those other charlatans.



I cannot agree with you two stalwarts. (about being NEVER wrong)

A prophet, like any other human, is fallible and can fall (or willingly embrace) sin.

Take Balaam (the donkey's ass)...

most definitely prophesied... most definitely became sinful...



Covaan_Meshuga -> RE: a word from a Prophet/Prophetess (5/17/2008 10:13:12 PM)

No one said that the prophet is personally without fault; according to the Bible, every prophecy must be 100% correct, or that person is a false prophet.



Kath -> RE: a word from a Prophet/Prophetess (5/17/2008 11:42:13 PM)

Thank you Abiyah, that is what I meant.



Covaan_Meshuga -> RE: a word from a Prophet/Prophetess (5/17/2008 11:50:43 PM)

[sm=icon_smile.gif]



Godddy -> RE: a word from a Prophet/Prophetess (5/18/2008 5:14:16 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Kath

quote:

ORIGINAL: SonInMe1

Thing is...a prophet is NEVER wrong. 100%


Exactly. Otherwise they are no better than Jeanne Dixon and all those other charlatans.

The prophets name is Rev, James Kennedy. He is pretty well known.
all though he is nearing his 80's, now. He has lived with a pacemaker for the last few years.
His health has been come and go, for the last few years, and says he wants to go home before the rest of the prophesy come upon the earth.
Believe me He is no Jeanne Dixon, if he even knows who she is.
He use to be a hunting guide, in our parts, northern Canada. He said
When God first called him, God said to go to a certain place, J.K. told us he only had a dime in his pocket, and he went, by the time he got to the buses, he had a bus ticket, and money for food.
God told him to open a Christian radio station, J.K. sold his house to get the money, now we have several christian radio stations in the north,
CJTK is one of them , If you go to google, and go to CJTK Christian Radio, you will get the station.
He now longer, heads there, but he goes in and gives prophesy over the air.
When he was at the station I worked there, I would go to the door and feel the Holy Spirit all over me. he would spend hours walking every foot of that place and prayer, and worship God.
I belonged to a Home bible church, and He is our spiritual Father.



oldmethuselah -> RE: a word from a Prophet/Prophetess (5/18/2008 11:13:34 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Covaan_Meshuga

No one said that the prophet is personally without fault; according to the Bible, every prophecy must be 100% correct, or that person is a false prophet.



Regretably, your position (as theoretically accurate as it may be) does not work in the world of humans.

This is best illustrated by considering the CONVERSE of your statement...

Balaam, as clearly indicated in the Bible, was "forced" to give an accurate prophecy at a time when his heart was far from devoted to God.

Thus EVEN when a prophecy is 100% ACCURATE, it is no recommendation about the prophet himself....

and CONVERSELY, when a godly prophet slips off the rails and gives a biased - obscure - prophecy, it does not UNDO and MAKE FALSE all previous prophecies by that individual...

The chap who has been mentioned in glowing terms, James Kennedy, is a mortal prone to sin as any of the rest of us.

Even if, for the moment, we agree that he is a TRUE PROPHET of God..., THIS IS NO INDICATION that the NEXT "prophecy" out of his mouth is TRUE....



Covaan_Meshuga -> RE: a word from a Prophet/Prophetess (5/18/2008 11:21:07 PM)

From the NASB with note numbers:
13:1 " R499 If a prophet or a dreamer of dreams arises among you and gives you a sign or a wonder,
13:2 and the sign or the wonder comes true, concerning which he spoke to you, saying, ' R500 Let us go after other gods (whom you have not known) and let us serve them,'
13:3 you shall not listen to the words of that prophet or that dreamer of dreams; for the LORD your God is testing R501 you to find out if you R502 love the LORD your God with all your heart and with all your soul.
13:4 " R503 You shall follow the LORD your God and fear Him; and you shall keep His commandments, listen to His voice, serve Him, and cling R504 to Him.
13:5 "But that prophet or that dreamer of dreams shall be put R505 to death, because he has counseled F181 rebellion F182 against the LORD your God who brought you from the land of Egypt and redeemed you from the house of slavery, F183 to R506 seduce you from the way in which the LORD your God commanded you to walk. So R507 you shall purge the evil from among you.


Here it is from the KJV:

Deuteronomy 13:1 If there arise among you a prophet, or a dreamer of dreams, and giveth thee a sign or a wonder, 2 And the sign or the wonder come to pass, whereof he spake unto thee, saying, Let us go after other gods, which thou hast not known, and let us serve them; 3 Thou shalt not hearken unto the words of that prophet, or that dreamer of dreams: for the LORD your God proveth you, to know whether ye love the LORD your God with all your heart and with all your soul. 4 Ye shall walk after the LORD your God, and fear him, and keep his commandments, and obey his voice, and ye shall serve him, and cleave unto him. 5 And that prophet, or that dreamer of dreams, shall be put to death; because he hath spoken to turn F42 you away from the LORD your God, which brought you out of the land of Egypt, and redeemed you out of the house of bondage, to thrust thee out of the way which the LORD thy God commanded thee to walk in. So shalt thou put the evil away from the midst of thee.

P.S. I don't know James Kennedy, and I am not a fan.



Covaan_Meshuga -> RE: a word from a Prophet/Prophetess (5/18/2008 11:25:42 PM)

Sorry -- that one wasn't it, but it's good, so I'll leave it. Try this one:
Deut 18:15 " R630 The LORD your God will raise up for you a prophet like me from among you, from your countrymen, F264 you shall listen to him. 16 "This is according R631 to all that you asked of the LORD your God in Horeb on the day of the assembly, saying, 'Let me not hear again the voice of the LORD my God, let me not see this great fire anymore, or I will die.' 20 'But the prophet who speaks a word presumptuously R636 in My name which I have not commanded him to speak, or which R637 he speaks in the name of other gods, that F267 prophet shall die.' 21 "You may say in your heart, 'How will we know the word which the LORD has not spoken?' 22 " R638 When a prophet speaks in the name of the LORD, if the thing does not come about or come true, that is the thing which the LORD has not spoken. The prophet has spoken it presumptuously; R639 you shall not be afraid of him.



oldmethuselah -> RE: a word from a Prophet/Prophetess (5/19/2008 7:05:19 AM)

It is precisely this rationale that Roman Catholics use to claim that the Pope's words are infallible when he is speaking "ex cathedra"



earthless -> RE: a word from a Prophet/Prophetess (5/19/2008 8:05:19 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: oldmethuselah

It is precisely this rationale that Roman Catholics use to claim that the Pope's words are infallible when he is speaking "ex cathedra"


Whatever the case, whenever a person claims to be speaking for God (the essence of prophecy) the key is to compare what is said with what the Bible says.

If God were to speak through a person today, it would be in 100% complete agreement with what God has already said in the Bible. God does not contradict Himself.

1 John 4:1 instructs us, “Dear friends, do not believe every spirit, but test the spirits to see whether they are from God, because many false prophets have gone out into the world.”

1 Thessalonians 5:20-21 declares, “Do not treat prophecies with contempt. Test everything. Hold on to the good.”

So, whether is it a “word from the Lord” or a supposed prophecy, our response should be the same. Compare what is said to what the Word of God says. If it contradicts the Bible, throw it out. If it agrees with the Bible, pray for wisdom and discernment as to how to apply the message (2 Timothy 3:16-17; James 1:5).

Because a person who holds the Office of Prophet is being used by God for Him to speak directly through the human's lips.. the prophecy will always come to pass, will always line up with Scripture, will always be true.



SonInMe1 -> RE: a word from a Prophet/Prophetess (5/19/2008 8:10:23 AM)

If it is the same James Kennedy who ran a large church here in south Florida...if I remember correctly, he passed.



JimboFletch -> RE: a word from a Prophet/Prophetess (5/19/2008 8:23:35 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: SonInMe1

If it is the same James Kennedy who ran a large church here in south Florida...if I remember correctly, he passed.

Dr. James Kennedy, was an American televangelist, megachurch pastor, and founder of the Coral Ridge Presbyterian Church in Fort Lauderdale, Florida, where he was senior pastor from 1960 until his death in 2007. (He last preached in December 2006.)

As far as I remember him, he was a prophet in the NT sense, he preached the scriptures and gave their meaning. I don't recall his ever "foretelling the future" in the OT or charismatic/pentecostal sense.



JimboFletch -> RE: a word from a Prophet/Prophetess (5/19/2008 8:32:18 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: oldmethuselah

quote:

ORIGINAL: Covaan_Meshuga

No one said that the prophet is personally without fault; according to the Bible, every prophecy must be 100% correct, or that person is a false prophet.



Regretably, your position (as theoretically accurate as it may be) does not work in the world of humans.
...
Even if, for the moment, we agree that he is a TRUE PROPHET of God..., THIS IS NO INDICATION that the NEXT "prophecy" out of his mouth is TRUE....

I have to disagree. The only way we have to know if a person truly speaks as a prophet on the OT sense (foretelling future events), is that every time they speak for God they are 100% accurate. If the the 3rd time or the 33rd time they are wrong, it is at that point we know for sure they are fakes.

Jeane Dixon claimed something like an 85% accuracy rate. That 15% failure is all the proof needed to classify her as a false prophet. (A little digging into her methods and philosophies would also tell you.)

Anyone that wants to stand and proclaim "Thus saith the Lord," lives with a different standard of accuracy than anyone else.



earthless -> RE: a word from a Prophet/Prophetess (5/19/2008 8:35:30 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: SonInMe1

If it is the same James Kennedy who ran a large church here in south Florida...if I remember correctly, he passed.


I don't think it's the same.. but we would need for him/her to confirm.



Covaan_Meshuga -> RE: a word from a Prophet/Prophetess (5/19/2008 1:04:12 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: SonInMe1
If it is the same James Kennedy who ran a large church here in south Florida...if I remember correctly, he passed.

Did he get a good grade, or did he just barely pass?



oldmethuselah -> 100% ALL or NONE? For a WHOLE Life? (5/19/2008 5:00:01 PM)

JimboFletch said:

quote:


I have to disagree. The only way we have to know if a person truly speaks as a prophet on the OT sense (foretelling future events), is that every time they speak for God they are 100% accurate. If the the 3rd time or the 33rd time they are wrong, it is at that point we know for sure they are fakes.

Anyone that wants to stand and proclaim "Thus saith the Lord," lives with a different standard of accuracy than anyone else.


This does not allow for human frailty - Balaam started out all right...and then there was GOLD!

In another (not prophet area but writer of Scripture) - David started out all right... and then there was BATHSHEBA!.

Jimbo... people GO OFF THE RAILS! It brings GREAT DISHONOUR to the church.... but it does NOT prove they were never speaking in the Spirit!



JimboFletch -> RE: 100% ALL or NONE? Fof a WHOLE Life? (5/19/2008 5:04:38 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: oldmethuselah

JimboFletch said:

quote:


I have to disagree. The only way we have to know if a person truly speaks as a prophet on the OT sense (foretelling future events), is that every time they speak for God they are 100% accurate. If the the 3rd time or the 33rd time they are wrong, it is at that point we know for sure they are fakes.

Anyone that wants to stand and proclaim "Thus saith the Lord," lives with a different standard of accuracy than anyone else.


This does not allow for human frailty...

I don't care a bit about human frailty when it comes to the only standard that matters - the Bible. Neither Balaam nor David are called into question for what they foretold in the name of God. Had either said, "Thus saith the Lord," and proceeded to give a false prophesy, then they would have been false prophets, even if they never broke a single Law.



earthless -> RE: 100% ALL or NONE? Fof a WHOLE Life? (5/20/2008 10:09:12 AM)

Exactly, Jimbo. There seems to be a misunderstanding of what is actually being discussed here.



Covaan_Meshuga -> RE: 100% ALL or NONE? Fof a WHOLE Life? (5/20/2008 10:38:24 AM)

Yeah. I don't know how it can be explained any better.



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