RE: 10 yr old daughter (Full Version)

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deliveredarling -> RE: 10 yr old daughter (5/11/2008 9:44:00 PM)

BTW Ladies:

[sm=flower.gif] Happy Mother's Day[sm=flower.gif]



agapetos -> RE: 10 yr old daughter (5/11/2008 10:14:23 PM)

quote:

Ladies, I'm feeling rather like some are looking down their nose at my parenting.
If I've given that impression, I apologise. It wasn't intended. But sometimes our tone is difficult to convey in forums.

quote:

the peddles are cracked.
Please watch out for these ~ I had a bike with cracked peddles and they broke when I was riding it and I came off.

quote:

I'm not convinced that it is a training or teaching issue. I'm more convinced it's a"I'm too busy, gotta go have fun" issue.
It's a training/teaching issue in that she needs to learn that before she has fun, she has to do chores. If she wants friends to stay the night, fine, she has to put her clothes in her wardrobe/drawers whenever she needs to. If she wants to play on her bike, she needs to pick up any clutter.

If you've had the patience to try different methods of getting her to do things, it can be difficult for her to adjust. It doesn't mean you're a bad mother, nor that she's a bad girl. My youngest niece has ADHD (she's 17 now) and her mother has tried so many ways to get her to be consistant in keeping her room tidy, instead of letting it get into a mess, then sorting it. She's a lot better now than she was, but it's not easy for her to settle to do it.



Sadey -> RE: 10 yr old daughter (5/11/2008 10:16:51 PM)

never heard of taking their room away. Brilliant idea.



pbaribeault -> RE: 10 yr old daughter (5/11/2008 10:34:54 PM)

Every issue is either an issue of >>training<< or >>motivation<< (or incapacity I suppose, but I won't be focusing on that). If you are pretty sure that she could do these things if she wanted to (not only the task itself, but the focus that it takes to fit that task into a day-full) then you should be thinking hard about motivation.

You seem to like natural consequences as a form of motivation (meaning: what just happens as a result of their choices) but with younger children, motivation generally involves more than natural consequences. This is because (1) the natural consequences tend to be to infrequent to make an impact (2) the natural consequence might be too severe, then you would rescue them, then the lesson would remain unlearned (3) young children can not reliably predict consequences that involve a lot of what-if factors (4) sometimes the natural consequences just don't happen the way you hoped they would.

So, a system of modified consequences can overcome this, when you provide kind of a simulation of the real world, but more consistently and in more concrete terms. Example: if you are mean to your friends they won't want to play with you... but the silly friends just seem to want to play no matter how mean it gets... so you simulate reality by sending the other child away when the child behaves poorly.

Similarly, a once-a-year loss of a critical item is not often enough to motivate your girl to clean up. Things like fire hazards (blocked vents) and health concerns (food stuff) you just don't want to let happen as a natural consequence... Natural consequences are not working, so instead you can simulate reality in a non-punitive way in order to make her care enough to work towards your goals.

You do this by missing activities because you won't let her in your car again until she has cleaned up after herself. And also by the other suggestions such as loosing items that become a hassle to you in public areas, not permitting her to have any guests over while her mess is sustained, even by taking away every item that she abuses or damages (simulating the reality of her eventually damaging it beyond usability... anything else with her short-term thinking will just encourage her to think of things like bikes as disposable and not worth detailed care).

If you take this route, let her know you mean business by making the initial disappearances permanent. Really. Then you can go down to a 'loose it for a week' kind of system, but she will always know it matters, because she will know you are willing to go ahead with an actual loss. (If "every kid" needs a bike - some other kid might enjoy having their needs met this summer, at her expense.)



peculiar_lady2 -> RE: 10 yr old daughter (5/11/2008 11:27:44 PM)

quote:

I'm not convinced that it is a training or teaching issue. I'm more convinced it's a"I'm too busy, gotta go have fun" issue.

but she's a kid so of course she wants to just go have fun....I mean, I know adults that still fight with that urge to just dump it all and go have fun first!!! That's not to say you haven;'t tried to train her, or that she hasn't tried to learn. Either she isn't mature enough to handle the responsibility, or she doesn't mentally connect things right yet, or she doesn't have the motivation yet to get it done. My mom never found my motivation...NEVER!!!! She even gave up homeschooling because of my lack of motivation in everything. It has taken me years of having my own family to find my own motivation. That however didn't stop my mom from continuing to keep after me my entire growing up years. You seem to be saying over and over again that she should be able to because of her age...well, age isn't the only thing to look at...what about her personality? Personality has more to do with it then anything IMO...I have four kids so far (fifth due next month) and all of them have been able to do different things at different ages because of their personalities. We could trust my now 8yo to do things at 5yo and do them the right way, yet my now 7yo still can't be trusted to do those same things. I am not trying to come across as mean or anything, but I am trying to tell you that training and teaching and learning doesn't ever end with kids. They have to learn things (and we have to teach things) in gradual steps through years of time. You can't expect her to just learn exactly how you are teaching...and you can't expect her learning to be just because of her age and supposed ability. I think you would fare better if you allow her personality to really lead you more then anything else.



deliveredarling -> RE: 10 yr old daughter (5/12/2008 6:21:38 AM)

I do prefer the natural consequence way. It's the reality of life. The will be here as long as she is on the earth... I see your point about simulated consequences too, though.

Maybe this is wrong..... I set standards for her, these standards are ones I know she can reach because I have seen her. I do this for her. She has a self defeating attitude and low self-esteem, due to the ADHD. These standards or goals are not unreachable. However, ever bit of progress she makes, she is praised for because she did it. I feel that it is more important for her to focus on her own achievements rather than being praised from the outside. I want her to be independent of the need for outside approval. So, I try to encourage her to do things for and by herself (things, that I know she can do) to help improve her self esteem and turn the I can'ts in to I did's.



Row1 -> RE: 10 yr old daughter (5/12/2008 10:13:38 AM)

hang in there!
she is simply at a point where she needs supervision.
partly because of her age, and partly, possibly, because of the adhd.

it might help to have regular time to clean room. i would maybe do this daily.

you just tell her what to do, then go stand at her door and watch as she does it. if you can, try to seem calm (i have to work on this one myself).

then, if she gets pretty good at cleaning her room, ask her if she would like to clean room without you watching, but you will just check up every ten minutes. [then redirect at that time if she needs redirection].



worthaboverubies -> RE: 10 yr old daughter (5/12/2008 11:45:35 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Brandy

My mother let me live in my room with 3 sets of clothes and my school books and bed. I could not keep it clean, and not shiny spotless but pigsty like you are describing. She emptied it completely and I earned back small amounts of things at a manageagle pace until I had reclaimed my things.



We did this with our daughter also. She still calls it the worse day of her life.[sm=Llol.gif] She is sooo dramatic.

It worked, she does a good job of keeping her room clean.



NotDoneYet -> RE: 10 yr old daughter (5/13/2008 8:30:36 PM)

In the long term, pick your battles.
Food wrappers, etc. are definite no-nos. For one child who repeatedly did things like that, he lost the "right" to a bedroom door. For the other boy who's room smelled like a locker room, I left a gas mask on his bed...gave him the "opportunity" to host the kitty litter box.
The littlest ones (the only ones at home now), all their toys got moved into the playroom, and no toys are allowed anywhere else in the house. The 5 year old used to go through her entire wardrobe and leave it all on the floor...solution...her clothes are in my room.
They're learning...little by little...however, decide what are absolutes and then decide what are things you "can live with". It works...You're less stressed, the kids are less stressed and being a family is fun again.
It took me many years to learn this...but now that we're parents of little ones again, I'm a lot more relaxed because I know what's important to me and what can slide.



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