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[Deleted] - 9/10/2008 8:33:09 PM
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RE: Emerging/Emergent Church Movement. - 9/10/2008 10:38:21 PM
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colliefan
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Then how does the emerging church handle this verse
quote:
1 Pet 1:17 - 21 (HCSB) 17And if you address as Father the One who judges impartially£ based on each one’s work,£ you are to conduct yourselves in reverence£ during this time of temporary residence. 18For you know that you were redeemed from your empty way of life£ inherited from the fathers, not with perishable things, like silver or gold,£ 19but with the precious blood of Christ,£ like that of a lamb£ without defect or blemish. 20He was destined£ £ before the foundation of the world, but was revealed at the end of the times£ for you 21who through Him are believers in God,£ who raised Him from the dead£ and gave Him glory,£ so that your faith and hope are in God .
Or. do you do as did Thomas Jefferson and cut out the parts that don't suit your theology>
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RE: Emerging/Emergent Church Movement. - 9/10/2008 10:54:48 PM
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colliefan
Posts: 3002
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From: Raleigh, NC
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and in this passage Jesus didn't tell His Apostles to form a UN and stop the war
Mark 13:5 - 8 (HCSB) 5Then Jesus began by telling them: “Watch out that no one deceives you. 6Many will come in My name,£ saying, ‘I am He,£’ and they will deceive£ many. 7When you hear of wars and rumors of wars,£ don’t be alarmed;£ these things must take place,£ but the end is not yet. 8For nation will rise up against nation, and kingdom against kingdom.£ There will be earthquakes in various places, and famines.£ These are the beginning£ of birth pains.£
you still haven't answered how a pacifist can logically support abortion
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RE: Emerging/Emergent Church Movement. - 9/10/2008 11:17:07 PM
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colliefan
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and these verses
Rom 3:21 - 26 (HCSB) 21But now, apart from the law, God’s righteousness has been revealed£—attested by the Law and the Prophets£ £ 22—that is, God’s righteousness through faith£ in Jesus Christ,£ £ to all who believe,£ since there is no distinction.£ 23For all have sinned£ and fall short of the£ glory of God. 24They are justified freely by His grace£ through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus.£ 25God presented Him as a propitiation£ £ through faith in His blood,£ to demonstrate His righteousness, because in His restraint God£ passed over the sins previously committed.£ 26He presented Him to demonstrate His righteousness at the present time, so that He would be righteous and declare righteous£ the one who has faith in Jesus.
Heb 2:14 - 18 (HCSB) 14Now since the children have flesh and blood in common, He also shared in these, so that through His death He might destroy the one holding the power of death—that is, the Devil£— 15and free those who were held in slavery all their lives by the fear of death.£ 16For it is clear that He does not reach out to help angels, but to help Abraham’s offspring. 17Therefore He had to be like His brothers in every way, so that He could become a merciful and faithful high priest in service£ to God, to make propitiation£ for the sins of the people.£ 18For since He Himself was tested and has suffered, He is able to help those who are tested.
1 John 2:1 - 2 (HCSB) 1My little children, I am writing you these things so that you may not sin. But if anyone does sin, we have an £advocate£ with the Father—Jesus Christ the righteous One. 2He Himself is the propitiation£ £ for our sins, and not only for ours, but also for those of the whole world.£
1 John 4:7 - 12 (HCSB) 7Dear friends, let us love one another, because love is from God, and everyone who loves has been born of God£ and knows God. 8The one who does not love does not know God, because God is love. 9God’s love was revealed among us in this way:£ God sent£ His £One and Only Son£ into the world so that we might live£ through Him. 10Love consists in this: not that we loved God, but that He loved us£ and sent His Son to be the£ propitiation£ £ for our sins. 11Dear friends, if God loved us in this way, we also must love one another.£ 12No one has ever seen God.£ £ If we love one another, God remains in£ us and His love is perfected in us.
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RE: Emerging/Emergent Church Movement. - 9/11/2008 2:01:50 AM
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Roberta_
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quote:
ORIGINAL: emerging
I am not sure why they moved the thread. And to put it here, under emerging church, is unclear.
I think I originally started this thread in Protestants Only. One of the mods wisely moved it to The Church, which is a better place for it anyway.
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RE: Emerging/Emergent Church Movement. - 9/11/2008 2:06:33 AM
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Roberta_
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What is the belief of most emergent churches on hell? The emergent churches that I've been too haven't mentioned it in the sermons that I've heard.
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[Deleted] - 9/11/2008 7:03:15 AM
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[Deleted] - 9/11/2008 7:53:06 AM
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RE: Emerging/Emergent Church Movement. - 9/11/2008 8:12:28 AM
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earthless
Posts: 6348
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From: where pigeons are wearing sweaters....
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quote:
ORIGINAL: emerging
quote:
ORIGINAL: earthless
* shakes head *
This Emergent movement makes even some in the Jesus Seminar blush....
Earthless,
I am surprised to hear you say something like this. You either know very little about the Jesus Seminar, Emergent movement or both.
Can you elaborate? In what ways does the Jesus Seminar look more like orthodox Christianity than emergent theology? How does denying the historicity of Jesus, his physical resurrection, the bulk of Jesus' teachings in the gospels even come close to looking more orthodox (and thus blush worthy) of the emergent movement?
I'd love to hear that.
I am VERY familiar with both - especially the Jesus Seminar, as my wife's old professor is one of its founders.
My point, albeit a simple one, is that the level of political correctness, subjectivism, liberalism, blurring of core essentials and moral stances from and by the Emergent movement is something that many would blush of even in the Jesus Seminar. Why? Because at least the Jesus Seminar is outright in their bias and doesn't pretend to be something they are not.
Now having said all of that - am I implying that everyone that professes to be a Christian in a emergent church is not a true born-again believer? Of course not.
But the truth of the matter is that many within its corridors do indeed hold to a watered down view on absolutes.
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Probing Today's Religious Movements | Promoting Doctrinal Discernment & Critical Thinking | Providing Reasons for Christian Faith & Ethics
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RE: Emerging/Emergent Church Movement. - 9/11/2008 8:16:44 AM
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jazzact13
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quote:
First of all, to cut and paste scripture as a means to support ones own theology is really no different than what Jefferson did.
Wow, that's....asinine!!!
Comparing what colliefan's doing to Jefferson? There is no similarity, emerging, so, please, just stop.
That's embarrassing.
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there is no justice in the rhetoric of class hatred
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[Deleted] - 9/11/2008 8:20:18 AM
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[Deleted] - 9/11/2008 8:22:55 AM
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RE: Emerging/Emergent Church Movement. - 9/11/2008 10:28:38 AM
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mcleod
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quote:
ORIGINAL: jazzact13
quote:
First of all, to cut and paste scripture as a means to support ones own theology is really no different than what Jefferson did.
Wow, that's....asinine!!!
Comparing what colliefan's doing to Jefferson? There is no similarity, emerging, so, please, just stop.
That's embarrassing.
Gee Jazzact how do you get away with this statement and not get a little nasty letter from the administration? Has a former boss of my would say you must be holding tongue your the right way. 
Lord knows if I was to make a statement like that they would aim their guns at me and tell me no more.
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RE: Emerging/Emergent Church Movement. - 9/11/2008 10:31:22 AM
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crankius
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Emerging,
I hope you will have time to answer my questions today.
quote:
ORIGINAL: crankius
quote:
ORIGINAL: emerging
quote:
ORIGINAL: crankius
I want to know what you think. Did Christ die on the cross to oppose domination systems?
edit--and I promise to come read your answer later...leaving for now.
I thought I did answer. But to say it again: Yes, he did die to oppose domination systems. But that is not the only reason.
Which domination systems did He come to oppose?
quote:
ORIGINAL: crankius
quote:
I will also qualify it to say that God's wrath is not to be confused with his anger towards us that could only be satiated with killing his own son.
What do you gain by removing God's anger towards sin?
What does wrath mean to you?
What does propitiation mean to you?
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Do not be overly righteous, Nor be overly wise: Why should you destroy yourself?
Ecclesiastes 7:16
SYSTEMATIC THEOLOGY
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RE: Emerging/Emergent Church Movement. - 9/11/2008 10:35:10 AM
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mcleod
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Say Mushhead where in the world are you? Don't say you left the planet. For I have seen you post a thing or two in other threads. But did not answer my question or comment about my post.In the Rob Bell thread.
Why in the world you guy's and gal's. Make these outlandish words against someone. Yet when we show some one wrong in their thought pattern you pack up and leave.
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[Deleted] - 9/11/2008 10:42:49 AM
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[Deleted] - 9/11/2008 10:51:37 AM
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RE: Emerging/Emergent Church Movement. - 9/11/2008 10:54:08 AM
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earthless
Posts: 6348
Joined: 4/11/2005
From: where pigeons are wearing sweaters....
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quote:
ORIGINAL: emerging
quote:
political correctness, subjectivism, liberalism, blurring of core essentials and moral stances
What are some examples of these that would make people in the Jesus Sem. "blush"?
You make whole bunch of broad, general, sweeping claims but offer no evidence that this is in fact, true.
Now, do some people in the emerging church have bad theology? Sure! Just as some people in the evangelical right have some bad theology. Just as some people in the liberal left have some bad theology. Just as some who are baptists, methodists, pentecostals, fundamentalists, non-denominationalists, etc. have some bad theology. Let us try to be humble as we approach the mysterious and majestic things of God, shall we? None of us have the corner market on absolute truth - only God.
peace.
Many Christians do indeed adhere to sound doctrine - to the core essentials (the absolutes) of Christianity. And they come from all over the different parts of the Church (universal), from Pentecostals, Baptists, Methodists, Catholics, Lutherans, Independent, etc..
There are secondary issues - which we may error on, which we may disagree on, but not have to divide over. But the core essentials are what they are - they are the line of demarcation between what is biblical Christianity and what is of the kingdom of the cults.
Emergent leaders, for the most part, blur the line by saying there are no absolutes.
_____________________________
Probing Today's Religious Movements | Promoting Doctrinal Discernment & Critical Thinking | Providing Reasons for Christian Faith & Ethics
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[Deleted] - 9/11/2008 11:01:42 AM
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[Deleted] - 9/11/2008 11:08:26 AM
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[Deleted] - 9/11/2008 11:14:16 AM
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RE: Emerging/Emergent Church Movement. - 9/11/2008 11:24:30 AM
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earthless
Posts: 6348
Joined: 4/11/2005
From: where pigeons are wearing sweaters....
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quote:
ORIGINAL: emerging
What are some examples of "absolutes" that you claim emergents deny?
peace.
Here is a quick listing of what many emergent leaders have said, written, preached, etc..
Denying that the Bible is the inerrant word of God.
Denying that Jesus Christ rose bodily from the grave.
Some have openly defied God’s word by ordaining practicing homosexuals.
Denying that salvation is found only in Jesus Christ.
Denying that Jesus Christ died on the cross as my substitute for my sins.
I am sure that many fellow brothers and sisters in the Lord have already posted exact quotes/examples of what I have shared above.
The point is that the leaders of this movement dumb down the absolute Word of God on items that are indeed core essentials.
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Probing Today's Religious Movements | Promoting Doctrinal Discernment & Critical Thinking | Providing Reasons for Christian Faith & Ethics
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[Deleted] - 9/11/2008 11:49:12 AM
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RE: Emerging/Emergent Church Movement. - 9/11/2008 12:32:01 PM
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mcleod
Posts: 1068
Joined: 4/4/2006
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quote:
ORIGINAL: earthless
quote:
ORIGINAL: emerging
What are some examples of "absolutes" that you claim emergents deny?
peace.
Here is a quick listing of what many emergent leaders have said, written, preached, etc..
Denying that the Bible is the inerrant word of God.
Denying that Jesus Christ rose bodily from the grave.
Some have openly defied God’s word by ordaining practicing homosexuals.
Denying that salvation is found only in Jesus Christ.
Denying that Jesus Christ died on the cross as my substitute for my sins.
I am sure that many fellow brothers and sisters in the Lord have already posted exact quotes/examples of what I have shared above.
The point is that the leaders of this movement dumb down the absolute Word of God on items that are indeed core essentials.
Just to add to your thought pattern. There are people in the Baptist, Pentecostal,Lutherns,Methodist, Undenominational and all aspect of so-called christians. Where you could make that statement and it would fit. There are probably humans in your gatherings. That have thought patterns simular to what you just said.
Let see as you have written you come from the Penticostal line. Could I use a broad brush and claim what your fellows believers think? Name and claim it. Speaking in tongues for salvation or a sign of salvation. Or being filled with the Spirit
By the way the last time the Word of God was made flesh. Not having ink or paper in him.
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