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RE: How would you react. - 6/26/2008 4:00:16 AM
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DenimDiva
Posts: 6313
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From: CA
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I have dealt with anyone with schizophrenia who was not getting the help they need. I know they are around, I've just never had to deal with them. I never knew that mental illness was an excuse for bad manners.
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RE: How would you react. - 6/26/2008 4:42:12 AM
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manda59
Posts: 5742
Joined: 9/22/2005
From: Hampshire, UK
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quote:
ORIGINAL: lightshineon
The side effects is why. the meds. I take them to the store (SIL) only., or daddy. Brother thinks FBI is after them. A common thought if you study this illness.
What side effects specifically?
(and btw I have worked with a number of schizophrenics, and paranoid schizophrenics, in my work as a Support Worker with homeless people, so I am familiar with how things are)
So, if you take them to the store, how do they get their alcohol and tobacco? Is it only when you take the SIL grocery shopping? And, more's the point, how do they get their drugs? (and which drugs are they abusing?)
< Message edited by manda59 -- 6/26/2008 4:48:41 AM >
_____________________________
"I love Manda's suggestion to just laugh most of it off.."
Tinkerbell, September 2008
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RE: How would you react. - 6/26/2008 4:50:32 AM
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manda59
Posts: 5742
Joined: 9/22/2005
From: Hampshire, UK
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quote:
ORIGINAL: DenimDiva
I never knew that mental illness was an excuse for bad manners.
It isn't.
The first schizophrenic I ever met was a young (20s) homeless heroin addict alcoholic (he was actually paranoid schizophrenic). He walked into our church, muttering about Hitler being after him, and I befriended him since no-one else really knew what to do (I didn't either, but I knew God would help me). I used to meet him in town for breakfast, help him with filling in forms, make sure he kept as well as he could, and was just his friend.
He was NEVER EVER rude to me.
Same goes for all the other mentally ill homeless people I have ever worked with.
The rudest ones were actually the plain ordinary alcoholics.
IMO the OP's brother is being rude to her, because he can (ie she allows it), not because he is mentally ill.
_____________________________
"I love Manda's suggestion to just laugh most of it off.."
Tinkerbell, September 2008
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RE: How would you react. - 6/26/2008 8:48:49 AM
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lightshineon
Posts: 3463
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They are the paraniod type also. True about manners, my sister in law is very sweet. They walk to the liquor store down the road. I would never take then for liquor. The good news is my brother has not drank, as far as I know for 45 days. The side effects according to them are this. Tiredness, weakness, sick stomach. Many with this illness think the goverment has taintee their meds. If you read about them you will understand, that many do not take their medication. I took SIL meds for years in medicine viles, and made sure she took them. She became much better, after being catatonic (sp). My Sil dad is a doctor in a nerby town, who is as sick as they are. He will subscribe them different medications. In their apartment complex, weed is avalible. Trust me I do not let Randall ( my brother) always be rude to me. I am headstrong, I just want to react to him in a more productive way, since the other way does not work. The tobacco issue is I will not buy it, but, if they are in the car with me, and ask me to stop, they can go in and get it. Having family memembers with illness is difficult. It is one thing to work with them, and let it go, but family is family. I think my brother suffers from stunted emotional development. He always is trying to imaitate someone else, for exzample, I am just like cousion David Hester, who is arrogant. I am saying this out of fairness, sometimes he can be very nice, and would give you his last dime, same as his wife. I have actually kicked him out of my van, in the heat. Lisa got out and walked with him. It is challenging, like I said I do not see them everyday, just call to check up on them everyday, or every other day, or SIL will call me. She probaly will today, she wants to borrow cake pans, sat. is my brothers B-day.
_____________________________
Remember, whenever you have pearls, there are always plenty of pigs nearby who would be glad to step on them.
F.T., 2007
Be sure you vote for those, whose views you want your children to emulate.
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RE: How would you react. - 6/26/2008 8:57:36 AM
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preserved
Posts: 924
Joined: 6/12/2007
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lightshineon...sounds like you need to seek a counsel of sort on how to deal with those who are mentally challenged. They have had this illness for quite some time now...and apparenly you have not seek any help on how to deal with them.
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RE: How would you react. - 6/26/2008 9:13:31 AM
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lightshineon
Posts: 3463
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No this is not true. I have sought counsel as much as the law allows, and talked to their doctors and others. They are greatly protected by law. I wish they had a family support group. In my small town, there are many mentally ill. A social worker, who used to go to curch with me has the same problem. She calls me about her brother, who stole a train, burned a million dollars worth of equipment, is in jail. She is in the social work field and laws are so strict, that she was calling me to see if I knew how she could get her brother committed. You hit a brick wall, trust me when you try anything, even for their benifit. I know thier illness is not my fault, and I am not mentally challenged (ill) whatever. We do not pick our families, I would not trade my family though warts and all. I have three children, a husband, a mom and dad in ill health, ministries, and a job, at local News Office, two border collies, two cats, and brother and SIL. It usually is a situational, day by day thing in dealing with them. I jst do not want to on those rare occasions, lose it in a mean way, when brother pushes my last button. 
quote:
ORIGINAL: preserved
lightshineon...sounds like you need to seek a counsel of sort on how to deal with those who are mentally challenged. They have had this illness for quite some time now...and apparenly you have not seek any help on how to deal with them.
_____________________________
Remember, whenever you have pearls, there are always plenty of pigs nearby who would be glad to step on them.
F.T., 2007
Be sure you vote for those, whose views you want your children to emulate.
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RE: How would you react. - 6/26/2008 9:28:07 AM
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Jenny-Fair
Posts: 6959
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I don't think you understand. We are not telling you that THEY need counseling. We are telling you that YOU need it. You are wanting to fix your brother, but that is impossible. You need to learn healthy ways of dealing with things--and not just your brother. I have been reading your posts for a long time and it is very clear to me that even without your brother, you have things that need dealing with. Please seek the help that you need.
_____________________________
Tony: Ziva, did you kill Houdini?
Ziva: It is possible. I do not remember all their names.
My Blog
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RE: How would you react. - 6/26/2008 9:58:45 AM
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pbaribeault
Posts: 1086
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quote:
I jst do not want to on those rare occasions, lose it in a mean way, when brother pushes my last button.
The way to do this is to not let him push your buttons. Keep your buttons out of his reach.
Don't go on saying to yourself, "I'm being good." (push button) "What can I do about it anyways?" (push button) "He can't help it." (push button) "I'm being longsuffering." (push button) "But he needsme." (push button) "He's usually so sweet" (push button) "Godly people don't get angry." (push button) "What will he do if I make him angry?" (push button) "It's not right to be mean to the disabled." (push button) "But I love him!" (push button) "I can't take it much longer..." (push button) BOOM!
Instead, just decide that it is important that you protect yourself from this problem path, and cut it off long before you are actually angry. Take action, set limits, make him live up to your standards or else you are not going to do any of the care-taking actions you usually do. That's the end of it.
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RE: How would you react. - 6/26/2008 3:36:48 PM
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PatricksPeaches
Posts: 303
Joined: 5/13/2008
From: Michigan
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Jenny-Fair
I don't think you understand. We are not telling you that THEY need counseling. We are telling you that YOU need it.
I agree!!! You will learn to deal with them more effectively and better understand their illness/addiction. The only person you can change is YOU! Start there!!!
_____________________________
*Robin*
I am not claiming to have all the answers but I'm holding on to the one who does!
-quoted from a song by 33Miles called Come With Me
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RE: How would you react. - 6/26/2008 9:21:49 PM
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Leslie_JnJs_mom
Posts: 933
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I think light was just venting a bit and looking for an encouraging shoulder to talk to not get a lecture on how trying to help out and make a difference somehow makes her evil. That may not be the way some wanted their message to sound but from someone who is just reading this topic that is how it sounds.
There are many ways to smack a person and not hurt in the least bit. My son makes smart alec comments that gets him a smack and he laughs at me. My husband makes fun of me and will get a smack and he thinks it is fun. I do not know how she smacked her brother but really I doubt she would come on a public group like this and say she was abusing her brother. That would make her nuts and she is not nuts.
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<------- Jessica and I had so much fun with grandma!
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RE: How would you react. - 6/27/2008 12:58:23 AM
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lightshineon
Posts: 3463
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Jenny we all have issues, even you ok. I am sure I am as balanced as you. It seems like you enjoy being negative to me. I am speaking how I feel. to you We are sisters but you strive to see the worst in me. Why are you so negative towards me? You need to seek help for negative behavior. I love you in the Lord, but you just seem to hate me for no reason. It does not matter if we are talking about Amish Children, or big breast. Leslie Thank you, I am not a victim, so I seek advice, that does not give people the right to tell me I need help for issues. Get the board out of your own eye. I hate talking to my sister like this, but it just gets in my crawl. I know I cannot fix my brother, I would have done it if I could, only God can. Remember to treat someone nicely, it is the Christian thing to do.
quote:
ORIGINAL: Jenny-Fair
I don't think you understand. We are not telling you that THEY need counseling. We are telling you that YOU need it. You are wanting to fix your brother, but that is impossible. You need to learn healthy ways of dealing with things--and not just your brother. I have been reading your posts for a long time and it is very clear to me that even without your brother, you have things that need dealing with. Please seek the help that you need.
< Message edited by lightshineon -- 6/27/2008 1:07:18 AM >
_____________________________
Remember, whenever you have pearls, there are always plenty of pigs nearby who would be glad to step on them.
F.T., 2007
Be sure you vote for those, whose views you want your children to emulate.
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RE: How would you react. - 6/27/2008 1:24:47 AM
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Jenny-Fair
Posts: 6959
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From: WA
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I am not being mean. I am being plain-spoken. I did not say you were evil for slapping your brother--I said it was indicative of your dysfunctional family relationships. I recommended you get help for that, and it's an honest and kind recommendation. You do not want to hear it, however, because change is scary (and I understand that, as I have been there). Well, go ahead and keep living the way you are, trying to make everything better for everyone else, hiding things from your husband, and being abused and taken advantage of by your brother and other family members. You obviously don't want to hear the truth, so there is nothing more the rest of us can do for you.
_____________________________
Tony: Ziva, did you kill Houdini?
Ziva: It is possible. I do not remember all their names.
My Blog
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RE: How would you react. - 6/27/2008 1:35:29 AM
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lightshineon
Posts: 3463
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My family is a good family, and I do not hide things form my husband just one thing, by not telling him that. We ( my husband and I have a great relationship, we have been married along time) My husband does not abuse me or my dear mom and dad. I do not need help, people actually really like me in the real world. If you do not have a family member with mental illness it is hard to cope with. I do not cope with him everyday. Change is not hard it is a part of life. Do s and be something for me, and be plain spoken just notb hateful to me. I try and be nice to you, you have some hidden problem with me, maybe you need to seek the Lord about. I want to be the best I can be in the Lord, understand that. I as well as you, are works in progress. We fail, we repent and go on. I will tell you what I have learned is let my yes, be yes and my no mean no to my brother. I thought abut it alot today at wor,. I should have stopped my car, and said Randall, give me the tabbaco now, or we are not moving. I give in to his spoiled ways. So from now on it will be that way.
quote:
ORIGINAL: Jenny-Fair
I am not being mean. I am being plain-spoken. I did not say you were evil for slapping your brother--I said it was indicative of your dysfunctional family relationships. I recommended you get help for that, and it's an honest and kind recommendation. You do not want to hear it, however, because change is scary (and I understand that, as I have been there). Well, go ahead and keep living the way you are, trying to make everything better for everyone else, hiding things from your husband, and being abused and taken advantage of by your brother and other family members. You obviously don't want to hear the truth, so there is nothing more the rest of us can do for you.
_____________________________
Remember, whenever you have pearls, there are always plenty of pigs nearby who would be glad to step on them.
F.T., 2007
Be sure you vote for those, whose views you want your children to emulate.
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RE: How would you react. - 6/27/2008 1:42:50 AM
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Jenny-Fair
Posts: 6959
Joined: 4/11/2005
From: WA
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quote:
If you do not have a family member with mental illness
Actually, I do. My sister is bipolar and autistic, which is a lovely combination (that was sarcasm). My youngest brother is a drug addict. My cousin has Tourette's. Every woman in my mom's side of the family except me is on anti-depressants. Add to that my mother being a practicing alcoholic for all of my growing up years, and various other family problems, and perhaps you can see that I am talking from experience in this thread, not out of animosity. From my perspective I can see what you either cannot see or do not want to see. I have no doubt people like you. You seem very sweet. That doesn't mean that you aren't continuing a dysfunctional way of living that you would be much happier leaving behind.
_____________________________
Tony: Ziva, did you kill Houdini?
Ziva: It is possible. I do not remember all their names.
My Blog
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RE: How would you react. - 6/27/2008 2:50:56 AM
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DenimDiva
Posts: 6313
Joined: 9/28/2007
From: CA
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A professional counselor may be able to offer some insight on how you should deal with the issues in your family, they will probably be a great help to you. If you go to see their doctors, of course you won't get very far. The doctor and/or counselor has to keep everything confidential therefore they can not divulge patient information and they will be little, if any, help to you.
quote:
ORIGINAL: lightshineon
If you do not have a family member with mental illness it is hard to cope with.
My mother is an alcoholic who has suffered depression ever since I've known her. I am bipolar and a recovering alcoholic.
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RE: How would you react. - 6/27/2008 8:58:39 AM
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lightshineon
Posts: 3463
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Jenny, I maybe seemed harsh, I know we all have our burdens, and you seem as you have your fair-share. My perspective is this. My family on my moms side since my great grandmother has suffered from a mental illness. GG actually died in an institution, my mom's mom Nana was, was a Christian of all Christians, but suffered from a mental illness doing with religon. Though, I never heard her speak against anyone, and loved God. Most of my aunts, on that side suffer from forms of it. I am very much sensative to fact, that because that is them, not me, it stops with me, the mental illness. I am sure maybe you are the same way, with your family history. I am fiesty, as my husband puts it (LOL) he chose our dog Rowdy,because he was small, and was beating up a bigger puppy, then grabbed my husbands shoe lace, all being the runt. He said ( kind of a compliment), that Rowdy's Spirit reminded him of me. Not your typical love language, but, his way of saying I am a fighter ( not physically, but spiritually). I will say there is a Christian counsler, in my small town that I have thought about talking too. Not, about brother and SIL, but that could come up. I thought about talking to him, about my young teenage daughter, and feelings of hurt at church, and where to go from here. She for certian needs to talk to him. In regaurds to the incident, my brother ( the latest) his wife was saying he swolled it, he already opened it. It was late going to see Mama at the hospital, and she was feeling, alone. Daddy was sick, and had to go home. The MARSA, and her heart was what she was in for, she has had staff in her foot for two years know. I sometimes resent, that I have to see over mom, and dads needs alone, though I will have no regrets. I am younger than my brother, but am older. Anyway, I was just plain weary, that day, and should of stopped the car, and said " We are not moving." concerning the slap, as Leslie put it, sometimes we do things that are wrong. This has been a number of years ago. I had gotten them an apartment, and the first night Lisa overdosed, was in intensive care, and in an institution for quite awhile. Randall was making a Ruckus, drunk, screaming he hated America, using the Lords name in vain. I had given him change for wash, he bought wine. I was furious, I tried wrestling it away from him, he spilled it on SIL couch. We wrestled he is bigger, and stronger, I got frustrated and slapped him. I think this was 2002. I also kicked him in the sensitive spot, got the wine and pourded down the drain. He was yelling, and I was afraid he would get kicked out of new apartment too. It was a mistake, That night my husband followed him in the van down a very busy road, he was drunk, husband ws frightened cars were going to hit him. He walked fifteen miles. That sobered him up. We lived only a few blocks away at the time, and every morning I took youngest to school he would be on my front porch waiting for me. He spent all day with me, doing errends, and such. He ws my friend for those months and got better. I want to cry right now. I love him, and SIL, and I do not enable them, but, give slight support. I used to go to their house when SIL got home from hospital. My hair dyer went out. I went there every morning, just to check on them really, and dry my hair. Thay would say it made their day, when I did that. I will do as my husband ask, about the car, I always do what he ask. This is just a glimpse into my family. Really though my immediate family, beside them, are stable. My husband is the kindest man, my parents love us. They spoil the girls, and love them so much. I love my mom and daddy so much, they are retired school teachers, I know I will lose them soon, and will miss them so much, but they are wonderful Christians. Love in Christ, and yes, like you I am straight-up,plain spoken when need to be. Though I pretty much try and be kind, unless, the occasion does not call for it. I do not turn the Temple tables over often ( joke), but when I do it is straight to the point, no non-necessary niceness, beating around the bush. Anyways, love in Jesus, as sisters who have alot in common I am sure would be good friends if we knew each other. Have a great day. 
quote:
ORIGINAL: Jenny-Fair
quote:
If you do not have a family member with mental illness
Actually, I do. My sister is bipolar and autistic, which is a lovely combination (that was sarcasm). My youngest brother is a drug addict. My cousin has Tourette's. Every woman in my mom's side of the family except me is on anti-depressants. Add to that my mother being a practicing alcoholic for all of my growing up years, and various other family problems, and perhaps you can see that I am talking from experience in this thread, not out of animosity. From my perspective I can see what you either cannot see or do not want to see. I have no doubt people like you. You seem very sweet. That doesn't mean that you aren't continuing a dysfunctional way of living that you would be much happier leaving behind.
< Message edited by lightshineon -- 6/27/2008 9:10:04 AM >
_____________________________
Remember, whenever you have pearls, there are always plenty of pigs nearby who would be glad to step on them.
F.T., 2007
Be sure you vote for those, whose views you want your children to emulate.
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RE: How would you react. - 6/27/2008 9:07:47 AM
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lightshineon
Posts: 3463
Joined: 4/11/2005
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Thank you, so much for your encouragement, we all need it form time to time. I will pray for your strength, and would appreciate your prayers for mine. Thanks again btw cute puppy, is it yours?
quote:
ORIGINAL: Calea37
Light,
As you already know, you won't be able to change him so I think just keeping it in prayer (as you are) and trying to take some of the pressure off of yourself will help... I really think the only "counselor" you need for this is Jesus. He'll give you the strength and wisdom to handle these situations. If you know you are having a bad day on a certain day you could postpone an outing...just giving yourself that extra time to talk to the Lord about it will probably help sometimes. There is something so great about knowing He understands how we feel!!
Hang in there!! God sees your heart and that you want to help your brother and He'll help you!
I have dysfunctional people in my life and no matter how much counseling I have gotten these people continue to be dysfunctional. LOL I have found that when I prepare myself with prayer for an encounter the encounter goes MUCH BETTER. Not necessarily because everything goes just right, but because God gives me the strength to deal with it. And I know He'll do that for you, too.
_____________________________
Remember, whenever you have pearls, there are always plenty of pigs nearby who would be glad to step on them.
F.T., 2007
Be sure you vote for those, whose views you want your children to emulate.
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RE: How would you react. - 6/27/2008 9:51:35 AM
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Kat_D
Posts: 3201
Joined: 9/2/2005
From: Where We Shake, Rattle & Roll!
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Lightshineon
they have medcation but do not take it. The side effects is why. the meds. Brother thinks FBI is after them.
Light, you know, they may use all those reasons they give you for not taking their meds, but in actuality it may be because they know they cannot drink when they are on them. Antipsychotics and alcohol can be deadly and they probably are well aware of this fact.
Dealing with those who are schizophrenic and drug/alcohol abusers is difficult even for professionals...and, again, it is obvious that their behavior has become such that you are having difficulty being with them without becoming upset and angry, therefore, if I were you, I'd only be with them when your husband can be there. Imho, you need his support and his ability to deal with them firmly.
_____________________________
~Kat
"...And God will wipe away every tear from their eyes...no more death, sorrow, nor crying."
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RE: How would you react. - 6/27/2008 10:49:17 AM
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jaimestarcross
Posts: 801
Joined: 11/28/2005
Status: online
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It may limit how much you can be around your brother and his wife
... if they don't want to take their meds. then I wouldn't be driving them
anywhere unless my husband was with me (in case either one of them acts out
while you are driving and could cause you to wreck the car etc.)
I do have family members who are mentally ill who live in NC - when one of my cousins (continually wouldn't take his meds. - kept getting in trouble) his social worker had him removed from his mom's home and he was placed in a group home for mentally ill adults in another part of the state. In there he's given his medication(he's also diabetic) each day, has balanced meals and is in adult day program and participate in the work skills class - it's a way for him to make a bit of spending change for personal items. (His government check for being mentally ill goes to the group home... he use to spend up all his check on booze, drugs etc and have nothing left for food,bills, meds. etc...)
This same cousin also had a girlfriend and they had a baby --- since neither of them would take their meds. or take care of their baby... their child was removed from their home and placed in foster care.
He thought not taking his meds. would get him a lot of attention and we'd all bend over backwards to cater to him... he got his eyes opened that we weren't going to do that and that he'd have to either take his meds. and work or he'd either end up in prison or a group home... fortunately he (went along with) going into a group home and following the rules.
*He didn't go hungry or anything while he was on his own but we didn't give him money because he drew a good check each month that covered his expenses if he'd used the money properly.... but he didn't do that. He lived with his mom but my cousin like many mentally challenged people - he's very strong and when he gets angry/upset he's able to lift up very heavy objects/people and toss them about like nothing!
It's hard to watch a loved one make bad decisions on a regular basis and not want to do something to help them. We had to keep things in perspective and make hard decisions for his own good... he didn't like them but now he's far better off than the young man who was roaming the streets abusing drugs and alcohol, fighting, not taking care of his diabetes and being belligerent to others.
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RE: How would you react. - 6/27/2008 10:52:47 AM
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agapetos
Posts: 5612
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From: This side of the lil duck pond!
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quote:
Jenny we all have issues, even you ok. I am sure I am as balanced as you. Light, you are right in that we all have issues. I don't know your or Jenny that well so can only guess that you are as balanced as each other  .
However, just because you are balanced does not mean that you know how to deal in the most effective way with your brother. It sounds as though you do a great deal for him and your sil. Why not think about seeing if there is any help you can get in order to help them more effectively and without a lot of heartache? You say you are headstrong and you want to react to him in a more productive way ~ then look and see what help is available. It may mean that it's classed as therapy, but that doesn't mean there's something unbalanced with you ~ just that you've spent so long doing things one way you can't always see things in a different way ~ sometimes it's useful to have an outsiders input.
I very specifically have not told my family that I have bipolar because of their reactions and their unwillingness to work with me to try and find how best to help me (maybe that is prejudging, but I'm working from past experience on different events here).
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(Gotta do what you gotta do)... and if he did something like with the antenna thing, I would just try to distract him with something else and not let him know that it was annoying me (like you would with a kid).
