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RE: Do you like being told how to worship? - 7/30/2008 9:50:23 AM
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bluestone
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quote:
ORIGINAL: kernsfamily
quote:
ORIGINAL: musicboss11
I admit it. I'm a rebel. During worship, I sit when I want to sit, and stand when I want to stand. I also raise my hands when I want to, and when I don't want to I don't.
ME TOO!
And, one time we were at this "revival" kind of thing at some other church quite a while back....and, the guy was up there telling everyone "all heads bowed, all eyes closed, etc....", but I kept my head up high, and eyes opened.....
meanwhile, that guy was going ON and ON about all the hands being raised throughout the room (in response to the "invitation" and his "message").....and while looking around, there may have been one or two raised, and i thought to myself, "what a farce this guy is"...
iam not a 'hand raiser' or a 'hand clapper'....
I have seen that junk too.."hands are going up around the room"..when in reality there are a couple of people with hands raised. Hooey!
_____________________________
I need Christ. Not something that resembles Christ.
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RE: Do you like being told how to worship? - 7/30/2008 9:50:49 AM
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Szaftoo
Posts: 813
Joined: 4/13/2005
From: So. Calif.
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I have no problem with a leader suggesting we do forms of worship that are clearly Biblical. In fact, I think a good leader will make suggestions during a service. If you aren't comfortable with them, don't do them.
I also don't have a problem with having us turn to our neighbor and say something. My greeting could be the only interaction that person gets and I am happy to do it.
I agree you shouldn't have discussed your concern with anyone other than the pastor. That's the way discord and discontentment start.
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RE: Do you like being told how to worship? - 7/30/2008 9:56:48 AM
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IMA_CHRISTIAN
Posts: 1680
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ok what about this - when in church its time to sing or listen to the bible verses being read for hte sermon - we are told to please stand. my knees hurt and i have started to keep sitting. i tried standing, but my knees hurt and i get aggrivated because standing up is causing me pain. so why do the minster say "please stand for the reading of the Word" or "please stand and sing hymn number 342". to me, thats also a ritual that i dont feel i need to. anyway while im standing, my knees are hurting and thats all that i can feel so i sit.
_____________________________
I'm just one of those Calvinistic robots for the Lord :)
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RE: Do you like being told how to worship? - 7/30/2008 10:03:22 AM
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kernsfamily
Posts: 1350
Joined: 4/26/2006
From: Dallas (originally Detroit)
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quote:
I have no problem with a leader suggesting we do forms of worship that are clearly Biblical.
I have asked my inlaws about "hand raising".....and, they "dismiss" it as unbiblical, and say it's just people wanting to call attention to themselves.....
(yeah, i know...there are many instances and mentions of raising your hands in the bible.....but, like many, they tend to overlook what they don't want to see when looking at scripture)
_____________________________
Proud dad of 3 great girls....Erin, Emilie and Elise
Blessed to have all of them in a "totally awesome" public elementary school!
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RE: Do you like being told how to worship? - 7/30/2008 10:21:37 AM
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JimboFletch
Posts: 6608
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quote:
ORIGINAL: IMA_CHRISTIAN
ok what about this - when in church its time to sing or listen to the bible verses being read for hte sermon - we are told to please stand. my knees hurt and i have started to keep sitting. i tried standing, but my knees hurt and i get aggrivated because standing up is causing me pain. so why do the minster say "please stand for the reading of the Word" or "please stand and sing hymn number 342". to me, thats also a ritual that i dont feel i need to. anyway while im standing, my knees are hurting and thats all that i can feel so i sit.
In my church, it is understood - and sometimes said - that those with problems standing should remain seated.
My problem is that we don't jump to our feet every time a Bible verse is read. If it's so important that we "honor God's Word by standing," then we should be consistent and always "honor God's Word by standing."
To be honest, I think it is done to give people a chance to stand before the 40-50 minute sermon gets started.
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RE: Do you like being told how to worship? - 7/30/2008 10:24:14 AM
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endless_night
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Seeing as God was the one who established us to worship a certain way because it pleases Him, I would rather worship the way He asked instead of trying to figure it out and be wrong. The bible tells us how to worship, I say, I love it. If it pleases Him for us to worship Him a certain way, I don't see why we would worship any other way.
_____________________________
The Fear of the LORD is the beginning of wisdom; A good understanding have all those who do His commandments. His praises endures forever.
Psalms 111:10
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RE: Do you like being told how to worship? - 7/30/2008 10:25:12 AM
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JimboFletch
Posts: 6608
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quote:
ORIGINAL: endless_night
Seeing as God was the one who established us to worship a certain way because it pleases Him. I would rather worship the way He asked instead of trying to figure it out and be wrong.
Seeing as the bible tells us how to worship, I say, I love it. If it pleases Him for us to worship Him a certain way, I don't see why we would worship any other way.
That way being: in spirit and in truth.
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RE: Do you like being told how to worship? - 7/30/2008 10:43:33 AM
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endless_night
Posts: 82
Joined: 6/17/2008
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quote:
ORIGINAL: IMA_CHRISTIAN
ok what about this - when in church its time to sing or listen to the bible verses being read for hte sermon - we are told to please stand. my knees hurt and i have started to keep sitting. i tried standing, but my knees hurt and i get aggrivated because standing up is causing me pain. so why do the minster say "please stand for the reading of the Word" or "please stand and sing hymn number 342". to me, thats also a ritual that i dont feel i need to. anyway while im standing, my knees are hurting and thats all that i can feel so i sit.
You are not standing because you are in pain. That is different compared to the mindset that "I will not stand because I don't feel like it and I'll do what I want to do." The intentions are different. Although, I don't really know where you stand because of the last sentence seem to have both; I'm in pain and I don't want to do it.
_____________________________
The Fear of the LORD is the beginning of wisdom; A good understanding have all those who do His commandments. His praises endures forever.
Psalms 111:10
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RE: Do you like being told how to worship? - 7/30/2008 10:50:00 AM
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bluestone
Posts: 2934
Joined: 2/25/2008
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I am a note taker. So when they say "Let us stand for the reading of the scripture", all my junk falls and rolls up under the pew.
_____________________________
I need Christ. Not something that resembles Christ.
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RE: Do you like being told how to worship? - 7/30/2008 11:32:57 AM
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Szaftoo
Posts: 813
Joined: 4/13/2005
From: So. Calif.
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quote:
ORIGINAL: kernsfamily
quote:
I have no problem with a leader suggesting we do forms of worship that are clearly Biblical.
I have asked my inlaws about "hand raising".....and, they "dismiss" it as unbiblical, and say it's just people wanting to call attention to themselves.....
(yeah, i know...there are many instances and mentions of raising your hands in the bible.....but, like many, they tend to overlook what they don't want to see when looking at scripture)
Raising hands in worship would be calling attention to yourself if you were looking around while do it. Most people have their eyes closed and are not paying any attention to what others are doing. Sometimes I raise my hands in total surrender and sometimes in awe.
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RE: Do you like being told how to worship? - 7/30/2008 11:41:12 AM
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kernsfamily
Posts: 1350
Joined: 4/26/2006
From: Dallas (originally Detroit)
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Szaftoo
quote:
ORIGINAL: kernsfamily
quote:
I have no problem with a leader suggesting we do forms of worship that are clearly Biblical.
I have asked my inlaws about "hand raising".....and, they "dismiss" it as unbiblical, and say it's just people wanting to call attention to themselves.....
(yeah, i know...there are many instances and mentions of raising your hands in the bible.....but, like many, they tend to overlook what they don't want to see when looking at scripture)
Raising hands in worship would be calling attention to yourself if you were looking around while do it. Most people have their eyes closed and are not paying any attention to what others are doing. Sometimes I raise my hands in total surrender and sometimes in awe.
was just wondering...i DO know where my inlaws are coming from.....they are the type of people that think that if they don't do it...or don't like it.....then it's "WRONG"....period.
very sad people, really....
_____________________________
Proud dad of 3 great girls....Erin, Emilie and Elise
Blessed to have all of them in a "totally awesome" public elementary school!
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RE: Do you like being told how to worship? - 7/30/2008 12:03:22 PM
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IMA_CHRISTIAN
Posts: 1680
Joined: 1/23/2006
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quote:
ORIGINAL: endless_night
quote:
ORIGINAL: IMA_CHRISTIAN
ok what about this - when in church its time to sing or listen to the bible verses being read for hte sermon - we are told to please stand. my knees hurt and i have started to keep sitting. i tried standing, but my knees hurt and i get aggrivated because standing up is causing me pain. so why do the minster say "please stand for the reading of the Word" or "please stand and sing hymn number 342". to me, thats also a ritual that i dont feel i need to. anyway while im standing, my knees are hurting and thats all that i can feel so i sit.
You are not standing because you are in pain. That is different compared to the mindset that "I will not stand because I don't feel like it and I'll do what I want to do." The intentions are different. Although, I don't really know where you stand because of the last sentence seem to have both; I'm in pain and I don't want to do it.
OH yeah, i would stand if i could. and i sometimes try, i guess its supposed to be showing respect to whatever is going on at the time. I dont like pain, so im trying to avoid it, but i feel kinda bad coz everyone is standing and i feel like i "should". but lately the knees win so i sit :)
_____________________________
I'm just one of those Calvinistic robots for the Lord :)
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RE: Do you like being told how to worship? - 7/30/2008 1:20:14 PM
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Covaan_Meshuga
Posts: 3646
Joined: 6/8/2005
From: a mother who let me live
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quote:
ORIGINAL: bluestone
Fact is, church is becoming a place where people are judged by how much movement and noise they make, and a worship leader or pastor is considered no good if they can't rally the congregation into thinking they are at a ballgame instead of church.  Amein! I have a sign above my desk at work -- a quote which reads:
Religion has accepted the monstrous heresy
that noise, size, activity and bluster
make [one] dear to God.
To a people caught in the tempest
God says, "Be still, and know that I am God."
quote:
ORIGINAL: kernsfamily
And, one time we were at this "revival" kind of thing . . . and, the guy was up there telling everyone "all heads bowed, all eyes closed, etc....", but I kept my head up high, and eyes opened.....
meanwhile, that guy was going ON and ON about all the hands being raised throughout the room (in response to the "invitation" and his "message").....and while looking around, there may have been one or two raised, and i thought to myself, "what a farce this guy is"...
quote:
ORIGINAL: bluestone
I have seen that junk too.."hands are going up around the room"..when in reality there are a couple of people with hands raised. Hooey!
Oh, wow! I thought I had just been mistaken! So they DO do this!! Wow!
quote:
ORIGINAL: IMA_CHRISTIAN
ok what about this - when in church its time to sing or listen to the bible verses being read for hte sermon - we are told to please stand. my knees hurt and i have started to keep sitting. i tried standing, but my knees hurt and i get aggrivated because standing up is causing me pain. so why do the minster say "please stand for the reading of the Word" or "please stand and sing hymn number 342". to me, thats also a ritual that i dont feel i need to. anyway while im standing, my knees are hurting and thats all that i can feel so i sit. In the Bible, when it tells about Scripture being read, and anything is mentioned about the position of the hearers, they stood. It is biblical. Where I attend, we always stand during the reading of Scripture. I understand that many Baptist churches do this, too.
Where I attend, however, anyone with a physical problem, the aged who cannot/should not stand, anyone who is not well for some reason, knows that they do not have to stand. No one thinks anything of these not standing nor of visitors not standing, etc. There is good reason for standing as Scripture is read -- out or respect for the Author -- but He has always made the sustenance of life utmost, and that includes people who clearly should not stand during such readings.
_____________________________
Abiyah
"Ladies and gentlemen, there are things that you will only be able to learn by the weakest among us, and when you snuff them out, you are the one that loses." ~~Gianna Jesson, 1977 LA, CA, saline abortion survivor
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RE: Do you like being told how to worship? - 7/30/2008 3:22:59 PM
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IMA_CHRISTIAN
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Joined: 1/23/2006
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Covaan_Meshuga
meanwhile, that guy was going ON and ON about all the hands being raised throughout the room (in response to the "invitation" and his "message").....and while looking around, there may have been one or two raised,
i too get tempted to peek around and see if any hands are raised.
_____________________________
I'm just one of those Calvinistic robots for the Lord :)
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RE: Do you like being told how to worship? - 7/30/2008 4:26:35 PM
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Covaan_Meshuga
Posts: 3646
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From: a mother who let me live
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I haven't had good luck with evangelists. I know that it may sound bad, but of the ones I had to deal with in the old church and when my parents would go to "revivals," most, not quite all, seemed like attention junkies.
Over 50 years of that stuff, there were a couple whom others called "evangelists," although they did not call themselves that, who were not attention junkies and were somewhat turned off by all the hoopla.
_____________________________
Abiyah
"Ladies and gentlemen, there are things that you will only be able to learn by the weakest among us, and when you snuff them out, you are the one that loses." ~~Gianna Jesson, 1977 LA, CA, saline abortion survivor
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RE: Do you like being told how to worship? - 7/30/2008 4:34:46 PM
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Qtman
Posts: 9954
Joined: 3/21/2006
From: Crimson Tide Country
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I am not opposed to being told how to worship as long as it is the Holy Spirit doing the telling. I am not opposed to raising my hands in praise as long as the HS has placed it on my heart to do so. Other than that I think a lot of it is showy.
_____________________________
A friend gave me a report with Stats showing that 4,153,237 people got married last year. Now I don't want to start any trouble but I can't help but wonder. Shouldn't that be an even number?
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RE: Do you like being told how to worship? - 7/30/2008 4:53:23 PM
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bluestone
Posts: 2934
Joined: 2/25/2008
From: United States of America
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whoop, holler, run the isles, weep, wail, gnash teeth.
_____________________________
I need Christ. Not something that resembles Christ.
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RE: Do you like being told how to worship? - 7/30/2008 4:54:01 PM
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Beanteaser
Posts: 242
Joined: 6/23/2005
From: Minnesota
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Qtman
Other than that I think a lot of it is showy.
I agree! I have attended many charismatic services and think many people try to out worship others.....like it's some contest or something.
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RE: Do you like being told how to worship? - 7/30/2008 4:59:10 PM
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Qtman
Posts: 9954
Joined: 3/21/2006
From: Crimson Tide Country
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Me too Beanteaser. Actually I have been in both type of service. Some where things were done simply because they are expected withpeople looking around to see if they were being watched and I have been to some where there was no doubt it was done out of total praise. You can tell the difference.
_____________________________
A friend gave me a report with Stats showing that 4,153,237 people got married last year. Now I don't want to start any trouble but I can't help but wonder. Shouldn't that be an even number?
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RE: Do you like being told how to worship? - 7/30/2008 5:41:04 PM
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musicboss11
Posts: 560
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I should clarify, my decision to sit/not sit, or raise hands/not raise hands isn't based on how I "feel". It's based on my worship time with God. If I'm not being lead to raise my hands I won't. My worship is for God, and Him alone and therefore I won't raise my hands if it's fake/a show.
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RE: Do you like being told how to worship? - 7/30/2008 5:42:28 PM
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drfuss
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drfuss: IMHO, people who are more emotional in church tend to be less ratrionale/scripture oriented than the average person. I suspect those of us on this forum tend to be the some of the more rationale/scripture oriented people in our churches or we would not be on here.
If the more emotional people were commenting on this thread, their positions on this issue could be very different. Just a thought.
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Much to the chagrin of the visiting evangelist.
