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Fat fee? Paying because of obesity - 8/26/2008 7:09:28 AM
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deliveredarling
Posts: 1936
Joined: 8/30/2007
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Alabama is charging a fat fee for those workers who are obese. See story here h
ttp://articles.moneycentral.msn.com/Insurance/InsureYourHealth/AlabamaHitsObeseWorkersWithFee.aspx
Before you know it there won't be a company around paying for health benefits. I don't believe it's really about concern for the employees health.
When is enough enough? This is too much government interference.
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"Now no one after lighting a lamp covers it over with a container, or puts it under a bed: but he puts it on a lampstand, in order that those who come in may see the light."
Luke 8:16
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RE: Fat fee? Paying because of obesity - 8/26/2008 8:03:41 AM
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iluvatar
Posts: 1938
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It's not really that novel of an idea - if you live an unhealthy lifestyle, you pay more for your health insurance.
quote:
This is too much government interference.
This isn't government interference. The reason the Alabama gov't is involved is because this is its policy towards its own (i.e. state) employees.
quote:
Walter Lindstrom, founder of the Obesity Law and Advocacy Center in California, is concerned that all overweight Alabama employees will get is advice to walk more and to broil their chicken.
"The state will feel good about itself for offering something, and the person of size will end up paying $300 a year for the bad luck of having a chronic disease his/her state-sponsored insurance program failed to cover in an appropriate and meaningful fashion," he said.
That, IMO, is a valid concern.
-Dan.
_____________________________
Well, I've been to one world fair, a picnic, and a rodeo, and that's the stupidest thing I ever heard come over a set of earphones.
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RE: Fat fee? Paying because of obesity - 8/26/2008 10:08:25 AM
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Sophie11
Posts: 777
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I think when it comes to health insurance, it is a good idea to run it the same way you would a car insurance. What I mean is that the healthier you are, the cheaper the rate, and if you are a heavy drinker, smoker, or are more than a hundred pounds overweight then you pay more, the same way a safe driver with no accidents pays less than one who is constantly wrecking their vehicle and receiving traffic violations. It would be encouragement to people to stay healthy.
Anyway, someone who keeps up a steady weight of 4 or 5 hundred pounds is definitely doing just as much to possibly shorten their life as a person who smokes a pack a day. And if they are going to charge the people who smoke the fee, then it only makes sense to charge others ruining their health as well, at least IMO.
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RE: Fat fee? Paying because of obesity - 8/26/2008 10:59:34 AM
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Zhi
Posts: 1428
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This will last probably until they come up with an "HIV fee" or a "promiscuous fee" and then a fit will be thrown by all parties and it will all be called unreasonable.
Body mass index is a stupid metric.
My husband's BMI is high. His cholesterol and blood pressure are normal. His main issue is that while yes, he does have some fat that he would like to get rid of, he also has the physique of a bodybuilder, and he has huge muscles, well, everywhere. He moved a 300 lb boiler core last weekend, and he's not sore. One of his thighs is thicker than my waist (when I'm not pregnant, heh). His estimated % body fat is not really all that high, compared to what would be expected from his BMI.
Throwing out a number of lbs overweight is kind of unfair too. A 5' woman being 100 lbs overweight has a much more severe problem than a 6'6" man being 100 lbs overweight.
_____________________________
The optimist says the glass is half full. The pessimist says the glass is half empty. The engineer says the glass is twice as large as it needs to be.
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RE: Fat fee? Paying because of obesity - 8/26/2008 11:03:40 AM
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bluestone
Posts: 2934
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Exactly how overweight do you have to be for this fee to apply?
25 lbs?
50?
75?
100?
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RE: Fat fee? Paying because of obesity - 8/26/2008 11:12:47 AM
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deliveredarling
Posts: 1936
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My problem with the whole thing is, we pay for insurance to help with our medical problems. That's the whole reason we but it in the first place. This is a sneaky way of getting people to pay fot the insurance, yet are denied the coverage for said problem. We will be paying for it and more on top of it, and the problems still may not be corrected.
I currently pay a deductible of $400. per person in my family. Now,we have yet to ever meet that deductible. It's all out of pocket until the said deductible is met. Now, I am paying for insurance that I don't use. That money that is not be used my family goes to pay the claims on other people. If my rates were to go up,because of BMI or smoking, I'm still paying and not being able to make use of my insurance. Basically throwing that money away.
They want to say these are rick factors that are being charged for. OK, what about the extreme sports enthusiast? What about the chronic alcoholic? Why are these people's rick factor's being examined, why is it just obesity? Isn't the risk higher for some other groups as well?
The state can put any kind of spin on it they want. It's not looking out for the best interest of the employee. It's looking out for it's own best interest. It gives them a solid reason to deny claims. Claims that are denied , is money saved for the state.
_____________________________
"Now no one after lighting a lamp covers it over with a container, or puts it under a bed: but he puts it on a lampstand, in order that those who come in may see the light."
Luke 8:16
http://www.myspace.com/egaip
Come visit
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RE: Fat fee? Paying because of obesity - 8/26/2008 11:17:05 AM
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deliveredarling
Posts: 1936
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Bluestone, Here is a quote from the article:
The board will apply the obesity charge to anyone with a body mass index of 35 or higher who is not making progress. A person 5 feet 6 inches tall weighing 220 pounds, for example, would have a BMI of 35.5. A BMI of 30 is considered the threshold for obesity
_____________________________
"Now no one after lighting a lamp covers it over with a container, or puts it under a bed: but he puts it on a lampstand, in order that those who come in may see the light."
Luke 8:16
http://www.myspace.com/egaip
Come visit
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RE: Fat fee? Paying because of obesity - 8/26/2008 11:17:39 AM
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bluestone
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Our work policy on everyone went up over $80.00 a month per person this year. Because our two smokers had bypass surgery, and are both diabetics and on a lot of meds. No one else was in the hospital all year! Including our obese employees.
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I need Christ. Not something that resembles Christ.
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RE: Fat fee? Paying because of obesity - 8/26/2008 11:21:34 AM
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deliveredarling
Posts: 1936
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Just think about how much money people already pay for insurance. And the 1000's of people who are like my family and high the high deductibles before insurance pays!
That is a lot of money and they are claiming the expense of certain individuals! What a crock!
_____________________________
"Now no one after lighting a lamp covers it over with a container, or puts it under a bed: but he puts it on a lampstand, in order that those who come in may see the light."
Luke 8:16
http://www.myspace.com/egaip
Come visit
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RE: Fat fee? Paying because of obesity - 8/26/2008 12:19:25 PM
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JimboFletch
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The company where I'd worked for over 24 years strongly urged those of us over 53 to take an "early-retirement" package a couple of years ago. Some of us were forced to take the package after receiving lay-off notices. Initially, the cost was $400 a month.
At the end of the first year, they took us from the employee group rates and put us in a 55+ age group, which automatically jack everybody's rates up. Our rates are now $600 at month and we can either pay that or drop out. We are not permitted to change our deductibles or coverage. We're locked in to the coverage we had when I made one third higher pay than now. Rates are expected to go up another 20% in January.
I think they prefer we just drop the coverage and become somebody else's problem.
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RE: Fat fee? Paying because of obesity - 8/26/2008 12:25:41 PM
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deliveredarling
Posts: 1936
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This happened to my in laws. My FIL had a retirement package. The company sold and the new owners changed the terms of agreement. Their premiums sky rocketed to 800 per mo. Because my mil had high blood pressure they have now excluded her altogether. She can't get insurance period. FIL now pays around $550 pr month and rarely ever gets sick!
_____________________________
"Now no one after lighting a lamp covers it over with a container, or puts it under a bed: but he puts it on a lampstand, in order that those who come in may see the light."
Luke 8:16
http://www.myspace.com/egaip
Come visit
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RE: Fat fee? Paying because of obesity - 8/26/2008 3:44:36 PM
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mapachito13
Posts: 2498
Joined: 10/1/2007
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Sophie11
I think when it comes to health insurance, it is a good idea to run it the same way you would a car insurance. What I mean is that the healthier you are, the cheaper the rate, and if you are a heavy drinker, smoker, or are more than a hundred pounds overweight then you pay more, the same way a safe driver with no accidents pays less than one who is constantly wrecking their vehicle and receiving traffic violations. It would be encouragement to people to stay healthy.
Anyway, someone who keeps up a steady weight of 4 or 5 hundred pounds is definitely doing just as much to possibly shorten their life as a person who smokes a pack a day. And if they are going to charge the people who smoke the fee, then it only makes sense to charge others ruining their health as well, at least IMO.
I agree with that Sophie!
quote:
ORIGINAL: Zhi
Body mass index is a stupid metric.
My husband's BMI is high. His cholesterol and blood pressure are normal. His main issue is that while yes, he does have some fat that he would like to get rid of, he also has the physique of a bodybuilder, and he has huge muscles, well, everywhere. He moved a 300 lb boiler core last weekend, and he's not sore. One of his thighs is thicker than my waist (when I'm not pregnant, heh). His estimated % body fat is not really all that high, compared to what would be expected from his BMI.
I agree with you too! They could come up with a better way to determine if someone is at a healthy weight. It could be a combination of factors like weight, cholesterol level, blood pressure, etc.
BTW, Zhi, if I've ever said anything in one of my past posts that offended you I am heartily sorry! Please don't send your husband after me! 
_____________________________
Peace Sells....But Who's Buying!
"I would argue that the most serious threat to the United States is not someone hiding in a cave in Pakistan or Afghanistan, but our own fiscal irresponsibility."-David Walker, fmr comptroller general of the US
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RE: Fat fee? Paying because of obesity - 8/26/2008 7:16:59 PM
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Dancre
Posts: 1289
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Well, what about folks with eating disorders? Anorexia, etc? I work with a woman who is anorexic and one quit a year ago who was also anorexic. The one who quit had to go to a hospital that deals with eating disorders. So what about them? Will they have to one day pay? It seems the ones with the eating disorders were more of a burden than those who are overweight. I do work with one woman who is obese, but she's not in the hospital at all as opposed to the anorexic. I'm wondering if this is just a case of 'hate the fat people'.
quote:
ORIGINAL: deliveredarling
Alabama is charging a fat fee for those workers who are obese. See story here h
ttp://articles.moneycenmsn.com/Insurance/InsureYourHealth/AlabamaHitsObeseWorkersWithFee.aspx
Before you know it there won't be a company around paying for health benefits. I don't believe it's really about concern for the employees health.
When is enough enough? This is too much government interference.
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RE: Fat fee? Paying because of obesity - 8/26/2008 7:22:21 PM
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deliveredarling
Posts: 1936
Joined: 8/30/2007
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It sounds to me, more like,"if you don't fit our ideals of health, you will pay for it until you decide to conform to our way of thinking."
_____________________________
"Now no one after lighting a lamp covers it over with a container, or puts it under a bed: but he puts it on a lampstand, in order that those who come in may see the light."
Luke 8:16
http://www.myspace.com/egaip
Come visit
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RE: Fat fee? Paying because of obesity - 8/26/2008 9:35:22 PM
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stellaluna
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Like smoking, insurance companies think of obesity in generalities. Not every smoker gets cancer or emphysema or heart problems. But insurance premiums are higher for smokers across the board.
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Who should be allowed to attend church?
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RE: Fat fee? Paying because of obesity - 8/26/2008 10:09:24 PM
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Consecrated2God
Posts: 4935
Joined: 4/4/2005
From: Formerly Jesus Land
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I don't know about health insurance, but when we got life insurance they wanted to know everything about us. I was very pregnant at the time, and so the nurse that came to our house to check out our blood pressure and everything made a little note besides my weight so it wouldn't be counted against me.
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<--Plantation house in Louisiana
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RE: Fat fee? Paying because of obesity - 8/26/2008 11:51:51 PM
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relady
Posts: 1279
Joined: 4/11/2005
From: Greater St. Louis Metro
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quote:
I think when it comes to health insurance, it is a good idea to run it the same way you would a car insurance. What I mean is that the healthier you are, the cheaper the rate, and if you are a heavy drinker, smoker, or are more than a hundred pounds overweight then you pay more, the same way a safe driver with no accidents pays less than one who is constantly wrecking their vehicle and receiving traffic violations. It would be encouragement to people to stay healthy. But this kind of invalidates the reasoning behind GROUP health insurance in which the group as a whole determines the rate and everyone pays pretty much the same rate. If group insurance is going to do this then I don't much see the purpose of group health insurance. We should all just have to pay market rates or go without. 
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RE: Fat fee? Paying because of obesity - 8/26/2008 11:55:11 PM
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relady
Posts: 1279
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From: Greater St. Louis Metro
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quote:
I think they prefer we just drop the coverage and become somebody else's problem. consider yourself fortunate that your company even offers retiree benefits! Most don't. although it sounds like they are trying to get you to drop it. Well, when you turn 65 Medicare will be primary anyway, and any other insurance will be secondary.
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RE: Fat fee? Paying because of obesity - 8/27/2008 9:58:02 AM
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P31W
Posts: 2972
Joined: 6/13/2005
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quote:
I think when it comes to health insurance, it is a good idea to run it the same way you would a car insurance. What I mean is that the healthier you are, the cheaper the rate, and if you are a heavy drinker, smoker, or are more than a hundred pounds overweight then you pay more, the same way a safe driver with no accidents pays less than one who is constantly wrecking their vehicle and receiving traffic violations. It would be encouragement to people to stay healthy.
Bingo. I pay lower rates for my auto insurance because I "don't speed" and I don't drive a race car. Because I do have a good long safety record showing that I am a "responsible" driver not a reckless one.
If "I" choose to be overwieght, smoke and etc these are things that "I" should pay more not the people who take responsible for their health.
Why should "I" expect others to pay for my health problems that "I" have control over?
________
My brother offered his employees at one time a $15.00 per hour discount on their medical insurance for every hour they worked out in the gym. At first they all LOVED this idea. Now the program is gone because they stopped working out.
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RE: Fat fee? Paying because of obesity - 8/27/2008 10:09:59 AM
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P31W
Posts: 2972
Joined: 6/13/2005
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quote:
It sounds to me, more like,"if you don't fit our ideals of health, you will pay for it until you decide to conform to our way of thinking."
This is about "lifestyle choices" we all make.
My nephew pays several thousand dollars per year for his auto insurance. He has a "DUI Manslaughter" on his record. He made a choice to drive drunk and someone ended up dead. Who do "you" believe should pay for his choice to drive while drunk?
Do you believe it's OK to have your insurance go up a couple of thousand dollars per year to cover his "choice"?
Why should "I" have to pay for another person's lifestyle choice that cost the insurance company tons of money?
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RE: Fat fee? Paying because of obesity - 8/27/2008 10:19:07 AM
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P31W
Posts: 2972
Joined: 6/13/2005
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quote:
The state can put any kind of spin on it they want. It's not looking out for the best interest of the employee. It's looking out for it's own best interest. It gives them a solid reason to deny claims. Claims that are denied , is money saved for the state.
Maybe the state is looking out for the best interest of the taxpayers.
You will meet your $400.00 deductable which is not considered to be a high one. . We have a $1,000.00 per person deductable (and considering raising it to 5,000.00) and went many years without ever reaching it. Then my son broke his leg and almost died. (many people don't realize you can die from a broken leg but you can) The hospital and doctors bills were over $57,000.00
You do not want to be without medical coverage. If it means you must lose some weight and stop smoking inorder to have it then I think it's a wise move.
You may want to look into raising your deductable to a thousand dollars. Put the money you would save into a savings account for medical bills. In other words begin to "self insure" a little more and don't pay the insurance company to take on as much risk for your lifestyle choices. Take the risk on yourself. It might motivate you to make healthier choices.
< Message edited by P31W -- 8/27/2008 10:32:43 AM >
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