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RE: pray for Ray Boltz... - 9/20/2008 11:44:52 PM
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gtrdave
Posts: 252
Joined: 10/25/2006
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Philippians 1:15-18
It is true that some preach Christ out of envy and rivalry, but others out of goodwill. The latter do so in love, knowing that I am put here for the defense of the gospel. The former preach Christ out of selfish ambition, not sincerely, supposing that they can stir up trouble for me while I am in chains. But what does it matter? The important thing is that in every way, whether from false motives or true, Christ is preached. And because of this I rejoice.
Regardless of Ray's troubled state over the past 3 decades, he apparently was still preaching the Gospel message through his songs and probably through his words.
Whether his motives were selfish or not...I'm not equipped to answer...but, like Paul said, "The important thing is...Christ is preached." and we can all rejoice because of that.
I know that there was a time in my past when I was hardly in the right condition to preach the Gospel, but I did it because it is still truth.
It's sort of the "bad press is still press" mentality: a bunch of broken jars of clay like us preaching the Gospel is still preaching the Gospel.
I can not condone Ray's homosexuality, but neither can I condemn him. I can pray for him.
_____________________________
Seek the Lord and His strength; seek His face evermore!
http://www.myspace.com/byfaithmusic
http://www.myspace.com/daveplaystheguitar
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RE: pray for Ray Boltz... - 9/22/2008 4:22:51 AM
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eden512
Posts: 24
Joined: 3/27/2008
Status: offline
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Ray lived with my wife's family for a time around the time he came to the Lord in Northern Indiana. My father inlaw Dennis, his friend Jerry and Doug grew in the Lord and accepted Christ around the same time. They are very crushed and heart broken over Ray's decision but don't condemn him because they knew what a change had taken in his life. A broken, drug addicted, rock and roller coming to Christ and being used in powerful ways. From those who have known Ray over the years until the last few years when he stopped communicating, they say to pray for Ray but he most likely is not open to any dialog from anybody in Evangelical Circles. It's going to take The convicting power of the Holy Spirit and the God's Word to bring Ray back.
For Those interested here's a link to see Ray's first concert after his recent announcement. This is very sad and if it were not for the power of Christ, I would say this man is never coming back. He is widely received by the GLBT community which is helping and will continue to help him with justifcation by compromise rather than true Justification by Faith in Christ. You will see that Ray has a great disdain and almost mock for the Evangelical Christian church he left.
http://vimeo.com/1755093
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RE: pray for Ray Boltz... - 9/23/2008 5:38:23 PM
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2shaye
Posts: 5428
Joined: 4/12/2005
From: So. Cal.
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Can someone (mods, original poster) please give a warning on the first post? The link is to a homosexual web site and I was very offended by some of the ads there! I did not know that was where it was taking me!
_____________________________
aka Skipperjoe
I Love New York!
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RE: pray for Ray Boltz... - 9/23/2008 7:16:17 PM
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jwsduran
Posts: 33
Joined: 6/14/2007
Status: offline
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Humbleinspirit. That is what Ray is doing. Now he may lead a bunch of people to hell because he is justifying his sin. If he would confess and repent that is one thing.
Makarizo, God doesn't get any glory from Ray. God will have nothing to do with sin. I don't like to make light on how our Savior Jesus died. To say God has received Glory for Ray sinning is disgusting.
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RE: pray for Ray Boltz... - 9/23/2008 10:06:37 PM
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stellaluna
Posts: 4229
Joined: 4/11/2005
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quote:
ORIGINAL: 2shaye
Can someone (mods, original poster) please give a warning on the first post? The link is to a homosexual web site and I was very offended by some of the ads there! I did not know that was where it was taking me!
I didn't even see any ads when I looked at it.
The comments are interesting. I think it would behoove Christians to observe the conversation.
_____________________________
Who should be allowed to attend church?
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RE: pray for Ray Boltz... - 9/24/2008 8:39:10 AM
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kvsmm
Posts: 9
Joined: 4/30/2008
Status: offline
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Guys, sin is sin, and it doesn't matter if its murder, sexual perversion, adultery, lying (yes-white lies are sin), or gossip(it's not the evil that goes into a man's body that defiles him, but the evil that comes out, Matthew 15:11).
Yes, Mr. Bolz is living in sin, but can you honestly cast the first stone? I can't. Gluttony is one of the seven deadly sins. I am fat and thyroid, metabolism, etc., can't change the fact that I just eat too much, and don't exercise nearly enough. So do MANY of the 'good' folks in the Church.
One of the most moving albums that I own is by Jimmy Swaggart, done shortly after his admission of going to prostitutes. His song "Touch through me, Holy Spirit", spoke and speaks to me. I work in social services, and when I get a little jaded, it reminds me that my hands and heart are doing God's work. I really believe that God does use broken vessels, and if his music has blessed you, then Praise God!
kvsmm
_____________________________
"If you can read this, thank a teacher.
If you read this in English, thank a soldier."
Kvsmm
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RE: pray for Ray Boltz... - 9/24/2008 10:42:56 AM
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crankius
Posts: 4504
Joined: 4/12/2005
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quote:
I think those in the "don't judge" camp need to really study those scriptures in context. I haven't heard anyone here say they hope Ray doesn't repent and return to fellowship. But being truthful about his choice to live in persistent sin is not casting a stone.
Good post, Stella.
_____________________________
Do not be overly righteous, Nor be overly wise: Why should you destroy yourself?
Ecclesiastes 7:16
SYSTEMATIC THEOLOGY
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RE: pray for Ray Boltz... - 9/24/2008 2:03:11 PM
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buckifn
Posts: 1760
Joined: 5/23/2006
Status: offline
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I trashed his music and the only prayer I have for him is God reveals to him his need of repentance and true salvation.
Sin is sin- sexual or otherwise and we all need repentance when we sin.
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RE: pray for Ray Boltz... - 9/25/2008 12:19:49 AM
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gaylel1
Posts: 1291
Joined: 4/11/2005
From: Southern California, the land of Fruit and nuts...
Status: online
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In the bible, it says that people will turn away from God, even in the last days when we are living in now.
Ray chosen to live in that sin, and now he will have to face the conequences before God.
_____________________________
Hear "The Truth" with the "other"l Jeff Johnson(http://www.calvarydowney.org)
Visit me at http:www.gayleplace.blogspot.com or http://www.myspace.com/gaylel121
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RE: pray for Ray Boltz... - 9/25/2008 12:40:47 AM
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Giulia
Posts: 862
Joined: 9/29/2005
From: Giulia
Status: offline
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Far out!!!!!!!! That is crazy stuff. Quite shocking really. His music really ministered to me. If someone wants to choose to follow their flesh then it's their business really. I mean if he was walking spiritually this wouldn't come up because one of the things we are supposed to have is self control. That means no sex unless married and to marry another man is unnatural (if you are a man) passion and desire and not fruitful. I will keep him in my prayers. I understand the same sex attraction and sometimes it can be quite complex.
< Message edited by karlie -- 9/25/2008 12:58:23 AM >
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RE: pray for Ray Boltz... - 9/25/2008 2:49:14 PM
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Roberta_
Posts: 6917
Joined: 9/28/2007
From: East Bay Area
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I really liked his music. When my dd set up itunes, she kindly put some of my favorite music on there too. She forgot to put Boltz on there. I thought about asking her too. Now, I'm glad I didn't ask her too.
I honestly feel that he betrayed a lot of people. I know that gospel artists fall just like the rest of us. It's one thing when they fall, repent and ask for forgiveness. It's entirely different when they just fall.
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RE: pray for Ray Boltz... - 9/25/2008 3:58:00 PM
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Roberta_
Posts: 6917
Joined: 9/28/2007
From: East Bay Area
Status: offline
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Heartbreaking, isn't it?
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RE: pray for Ray Boltz... - 9/25/2008 8:06:36 PM
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RevRomansky
Posts: 1
Joined: 9/25/2008
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It's now time for Boltz to put on that millstone necklace.
We must be careful that, not wanting to judge him, we promote him. Discerning, calling out, condemning his practice of and promotion of Christian homosexuality, condemning his satanic degradation of the name of Jesus.
It's time to judge someone who has traded his soul for his lust, and encourages others to do the same. This is not someone who doesn't know better, he does, and he made a clear choice.
As to his music, "hating even the garment spotted by the flesh". Why would we continue to add to his income and fame when he is actively working against Jesus and promoting doctrines of demons?
Wake up, people. Sure, pray for Ray to repent. But those who hate Jesus and Christians are reveling in Boltz's coming out, and he's leading the parade.
And, I fear, he has lost his soul in the process.
Sadly,
RevRomansky
http://revromansky.wordpress.com
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RE: pray for Ray Boltz... - 9/25/2008 9:37:44 PM
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jwsduran
Posts: 33
Joined: 6/14/2007
Status: offline
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I had our radio station pull all of his music. It's time to stand up for Christ and quit this practice of not standing up for Jesus. It's time to contend for the Faith.
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RE: pray for Ray Boltz... - 9/26/2008 10:44:11 AM
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Bobby
Posts: 171
Joined: 4/11/2005
From: Orangeburg, Clemson Prefecture, Japan
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: jwsduran
I had our radio station pull all of his music. It's time to stand up for Christ and quit this practice of not standing up for Jesus. It's time to contend for the Faith.
Copyright monies is also an issue. We have one church across the street from home that I observed Wednesday (remember, I am in limbo with my home church because of major issues) and the youth don't care about this -- they say dancing to his music in church is still better than to sing sacred choral music from 300 years ago.
That's paying money to the copyright holders of his songs (WMG).
< Message edited by Bobby -- 9/26/2008 11:12:06 AM >
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RE: pray for Ray Boltz... - 9/26/2008 11:03:45 AM
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tafkam
Posts: 2143
Joined: 9/23/2005
Status: offline
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quote:
and the youth don't care about this -- they say dancing to his music in church is still better than to sing sacred choral music from 300 years ago.
Why do you insist on reposting this tired complaint in every freaking thread you post in?
_____________________________
"The nine most terrifying words in the English language are, 'I'm from the government and I'm here to help.' - Ronald Reagan
Tafkam
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RE: pray for Ray Boltz... - 9/26/2008 11:12:05 AM
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1love1God1way
Posts: 2384
Joined: 5/16/2005
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Bobby
quote:
ORIGINAL: jwsduran
I had our radio station pull all of his music. It's time to stand up for Christ and quit this practice of not standing up for Jesus. It's time to contend for the Faith.
Copyright monies is also an issue. We have one church across the street from home that I observed Wednesday (remember, I am in limbo with my home church because of major issues) and the youth don't care about this -- they say dancing to his music in church is still better than to sing sacred choral music from 300 years ago.
I can promise you there are NO youth out there still dancing to Ray Boltz music . . .
Good grief, it's 2008.
_____________________________
love.ben
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RE: pray for Ray Boltz... - 9/26/2008 11:17:11 AM
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tafkam
Posts: 2143
Joined: 9/23/2005
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quote:
I can promise you there are NO youth out there still dancing to Ray Boltz music . .
Assuming of course that there ever were....
_____________________________
"The nine most terrifying words in the English language are, 'I'm from the government and I'm here to help.' - Ronald Reagan
Tafkam
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RE: pray for Ray Boltz... - 9/26/2008 1:32:31 PM
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Market42Fan
Posts: 163
Joined: 9/10/2008
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: jwsduran
I had our radio station pull all of his music. It's time to stand up for Christ and quit this practice of not standing up for Jesus. It's time to contend for the Faith.
The stations I normally listen to are the AFR (American Family Radio) and/or Calvary Radio (Calvary Chapel).
AFR being part of the AFA, I'm pretty sure Boltz' stuff has been yanked there. I would expect that Calvary Radio did likewise.
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RE: pray for Ray Boltz... - 9/26/2008 2:10:57 PM
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rockitd
Posts: 487
Joined: 4/13/2005
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: eden512
Ray lived with my wife's family for a time around the time he came to the Lord in Northern Indiana. My father inlaw Dennis, his friend Jerry and Doug grew in the Lord and accepted Christ around the same time. They are very crushed and heart broken over Ray's decision but don't condemn him because they knew what a change had taken in his life. A broken, drug addicted, rock and roller coming to Christ and being used in powerful ways. From those who have known Ray over the years until the last few years when he stopped communicating, they say to pray for Ray but he most likely is not open to any dialog from anybody in Evangelical Circles. It's going to take The convicting power of the Holy Spirit and the God's Word to bring Ray back.
For Those interested here's a link to see Ray's first concert after his recent announcement. This is very sad and if it were not for the power of Christ, I would say this man is never coming back. He is widely received by the GLBT community which is helping and will continue to help him with justifcation by compromise rather than true Justification by Faith in Christ. You will see that Ray has a great disdain and almost mock for the Evangelical Christian church he left.
http://vimeo.com/1755093
That's so sad! I hate that a family is broken over this and that we continue to justify sin with a religious cloak!
_____________________________
He'll finish what He started Phil. 1:6
www.myccm.org/rockitd
www.myspace.com/rockitd
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RE: pray for Ray Boltz... - 9/26/2008 2:24:51 PM
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Bobby
Posts: 171
Joined: 4/11/2005
From: Orangeburg, Clemson Prefecture, Japan
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: 1love1God1way
quote:
ORIGINAL: Bobby
quote:
ORIGINAL: jwsduran
I had our radio station pull all of his music. It's time to stand up for Christ and quit this practice of not standing up for Jesus. It's time to contend for the Faith.
Copyright monies is also an issue. We have one church across the street from home that I observed Wednesday (remember, I am in limbo with my home church because of major issues) and the youth don't care about this -- they say dancing to his music in church is still better than to sing sacred choral music from 300 years ago.
I can promise you there are NO youth out there still dancing to Ray Boltz music . . .
Good grief, it's 2008.
The person running youth ministry at the church said the teen dancers dance to Boltz music still, and they've done it for many years, including recently.
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RE: pray for Ray Boltz... - 9/26/2008 2:37:51 PM
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rockitd
Posts: 487
Joined: 4/13/2005
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: eden512
Ray lived with my wife's family for a time around the time he came to the Lord in Northern Indiana. My father inlaw Dennis, his friend Jerry and Doug grew in the Lord and accepted Christ around the same time. They are very crushed and heart broken over Ray's decision but don't condemn him because they knew what a change had taken in his life. A broken, drug addicted, rock and roller coming to Christ and being used in powerful ways. From those who have known Ray over the years until the last few years when he stopped communicating, they say to pray for Ray but he most likely is not open to any dialog from anybody in Evangelical Circles. It's going to take The convicting power of the Holy Spirit and the God's Word to bring Ray back.
For Those interested here's a link to see Ray's first concert after his recent announcement. This is very sad and if it were not for the power of Christ, I would say this man is never coming back. He is widely received by the GLBT community which is helping and will continue to help him with justifcation by compromise rather than true Justification by Faith in Christ. You will see that Ray has a great disdain and almost mock for the Evangelical Christian church he left.
http://vimeo.com/1755093
The contrived music lacks the power his Christian had. "Don't tell me who to love?" How can you compare inter-RACIAL marriage to that of folk of the SAME sex? Regardless of color, they can still procreate!!! There's nothing in SCRIPTURE to be married to another race...it DOES prohibit homosexuality!!!
"When I know what a feel in my heart is right"? The HEART is decietful and desperately wicked, who can know it? You don't follow EMOTIONS...you follow GOD's WORD!!!
_____________________________
He'll finish what He started Phil. 1:6
www.myccm.org/rockitd
www.myspace.com/rockitd
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RE: pray for Ray Boltz... - 9/27/2008 12:21:42 AM
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1love1God1way
Posts: 2384
Joined: 5/16/2005
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Bobby
quote:
ORIGINAL: 1love1God1way
quote:
ORIGINAL: Bobby
quote:
ORIGINAL: jwsduran
I had our radio station pull all of his music. It's time to stand up for Christ and quit this practice of not standing up for Jesus. It's time to contend for the Faith.
Copyright monies is also an issue. We have one church across the street from home that I observed Wednesday (remember, I am in limbo with my home church because of major issues) and the youth don't care about this -- they say dancing to his music in church is still better than to sing sacred choral music from 300 years ago.
I can promise you there are NO youth out there still dancing to Ray Boltz music . . .
Good grief, it's 2008.
The person running youth ministry at the church said the teen dancers dance to Boltz music still, and they've done it for many years, including recently.
What a bizarre, counter-cultural, counter-good-taste youth ministry. . .
Definitely not the norm, I promise. I don't even need my degree in youth ministry to tell you that that just aint normal.
_____________________________
love.ben
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